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Announcer [00:00:03]:
Welcome to the Knife Junkie podcast, your weekly dose of knife news and information about knives and knife collecting. Here's your host, Bob the knife junkie DeMarco.

Bob DeMarco [00:00:16]:
Welcome to the knife junkie podcast. I'm Bob DeMarco. On this edition of the show, I'm speaking with custom knife maker, Jesse Jaros. Jesse is a stalwart of the modern knife making scene, having created some of the most sought after folders from the past 15 years. His knives are both hard use and maybe even tactical in nature, but they also have a refinement and beauty that have made them some of the most coveted among collectors. Over the years, his product lines have expanded, pulling Jesse into the design world, establishing his own brand, branded line with a legendary US knife maker. We'll meet Jesse, check out his work, and hear all about how he got where he is. But first, be sure to like, comment, subscribe, hit the notification bell, and download the show to your favorite podcast app.

Bob DeMarco [00:01:06]:
That way, you can listen on the go. And if you wanna help support the show, you can do so by going to Patreon and, checking out what we have to offer there. Quickest way to do that is to go to the knifejunkie.com /patreon. Again, the knifejunkie.com/patreon.

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Bob DeMarco [00:01:36]:
Jesse, it's very nice to meet you. Welcome to the Knife Junkie podcast, sir.

Jesse Jarosz [00:01:40]:
Thank you for having me. I'm excited to be here. Cool.

Bob DeMarco [00:01:42]:
Well, I wanna congratulate you first and foremost on 15 years of custom knife making. 15 years. How did you get started? Were you always a knife guy?

Jesse Jarosz [00:01:53]:
Yeah. It's a it's a crazy number to me. It just it's all gone by so fast and, yes. I have been a knife guy pretty much my whole life. I grew up on a farm and knives were always a thing to use, you know, hunting and fishing and, doing stuff around around the farm outside. So I've always been into them. Didn't get into really collecting until, like, maybe my later teenage years. And, I guess it was only natural that I eventually started tinkering with it and

Bob DeMarco [00:02:22]:
making my own. So working on a farm, living on a farm. I know that I'm speaking to you. You're in Montana currently as we speak, but, is that where you grew up, and and what's it like living on a farm?

Jesse Jarosz [00:02:35]:
No. I actually didn't grow up here. I grew up in Nebraska. And growing up on a farm is, pretty special. You know? As a kid, I just had a lot of opportunities to get out and play in the trees and, go cause trouble, but not cause anybody any any harm or, you know, issues like that that kids tend to do. So I was kinda left to, my own devices and, you know, went crazy out out on the farm and and, had a lot of fun. It was it was pretty special.

Bob DeMarco [00:03:08]:
So we've had a lot of guests on this show who have grown up on farms and lived out in the country and such, but, how how did you use your knives whilst on the farm?

Jesse Jarosz [00:03:20]:
You know, like I said, hunting, was probably the the primary, primary use of knives where they actually served a a, you know, real job. Otherwise, there was a lot of, you know, messing around as a kid, you know, carving spears and making, you know, various, weapons and and, you know, forts and and stuff like that. Playing survival, you know, as a kid, you don't know really know what you're doing. You're doing a lot of experimenting and and playing around, and and that was probably the most I used knives. But as far as actual application, there's a lot of hunting, you know, deer especially, upland birds, things like that.

Bob DeMarco [00:03:58]:
It's funny, talking about making survival, you know, playing survival in the woods and stuff like that. Growing up, I I had some woods behind my house, but I was definitely in suburbia. And the generation above me, on my dad's side grew up in Cleveland, downtown Cleveland, so definitely urban. And they played with knives, but in a different way. And they had a game called I think they called it dippity doo, where they would open up a a pocket knife and see how close they could throw it and stick it in the ground next to someone's foot without without nailing them. So may maybe survival in a different sort of way, but, you know, kinda cool. So how did you get started in actually making knives?

Jesse Jarosz [00:04:44]:
Yeah. That's kind of a funny story. I think this this part of the story is always a little blurry to me, but I think I still lived with my parents. So I'll backtrack a little bit. So when I graduated high school, I joined the National Guard and I had, you know, basic training and all that stuff, so I didn't go straight off to college. And, I lived with them for about a year after that, so I think I still live with them. And I got you know, I as a as a kid who's out of high school, I didn't wanna spend a ton of time at my parents' house, so I I left a lot, but I got snowed in for about a week. We had a huge blizzard, there in Nebraska, and I got really bored.

Jesse Jarosz [00:05:24]:
And my dad is a carpenter, so he's got a big shop, with lots of tools and stuff and some metalworking, equipment. So I went out there and and decided I was gonna make a knife because I've spent so much time, you know, looking at knives on the Internet and on the forums and all that stuff. And, kinda looked up a few tutorials and and just seeing other people making knives and experimenting with it, you know, piqued my curiosity. And I went out there and gave it my best shot. I made some pretty ugly stuff, but, that was kind of my first step into it. And it hooked me quick because right after that, you know, I was looking at equipment and and getting pretty serious about it. And it wasn't long after that, I moved and went out on my own. Part of part of the move part of my requirements for the move were that I had, you know, access to a decent spot where I could I could put up some equipment and further my knife making hobby at that time.

Bob DeMarco [00:06:21]:
So

Bob DeMarco [00:06:22]:
So 15, 16, 17 years ago when you were kinda checking things out on the Internet, who are the big guys? I I remember Tuf Thumbs. He's now Tuf Knives. I did a lot of, modding and stuff. And and for modders that led in, to knife making for a lot of guys. Who are you looking at and and who inspired you?

Jesse Jarosz [00:06:43]:
So I don't I don't know if you're too familiar with the usual suspect network. It was a pretty big thing back then when I got started, and I was on there as a kind of a collector. So that group of people heavily influenced, you know, the the, makers I was looking at and things I was even collecting. So a lot of the the major makers on there were, big influences on me, you know. You have, like, Ernest Emerson, of course, was probably the biggest one. And then, you know, a lot of a lot of of the custom makers on there were also tactical guys. Charles Marlowe.

Bob DeMarco [00:07:20]:
Oh my god.

Jesse Jarosz [00:07:21]:
Yeah. He was, somebody who lived about 2 hours away from me when I lived in Nebraska there. And, he hosted a little get together, you know, probably a year after I started making knives. And he did this annual get together. Anyway, I went down there, and, I didn't really know much about making, at that time. And I got to check out a shop and see, really nice knives. You know, at the time, I had never handled full blown customs. Being a kid, I couldn't afford such a thing.

Jesse Jarosz [00:07:52]:
And I gotta check out some really nice knives and, you know, his knives being, you know, the best of the best. They're incredible. And so getting to have that experience kind of blew my socks off and it's like, wow. The you know, there's the sky's the limit on on what you can do, you know, making knives. And, he was probably the biggest influence,

Bob DeMarco [00:08:10]:
you know, after I'd met him. That's crazy because, he's one of my, grail absquail, but, I I love his work. So that's interesting that he was a part oh, oh, I will be talking after this. I'm going to throw you an offer. Just kidding. But that's really cool. So Charles Marlowe, but also Nebraska, the Midwest, and the USN. I know a lot of, the USN has to do with that, triumvirate, you know, with with, Strider.

Bob DeMarco [00:08:45]:
I think Strider was maybe a part of that, but definitely Emerson, and he's one of my favorites also. As I was setting up this interview, I was talking about your knives are definitely hard use, from from what I've experienced, but also, kinda kinda tactical, but yours are classy tactical, if I can say that. Like, they're very refined with refined materials and and treatments and such. What about the tactical world brought you in, and how did that evolve into what you're making, which is tactical plus? And by plus, I mean, there's also a luxury element to what you do.

Jesse Jarosz [00:09:25]:
Yeah. Definitely. So, yeah, like I said earlier, being in the national guard at a young age, you know, a lot of my friends were also in that, in there with me. And, of course, you know, being in the military, we are into the tactical everything. Right? So, gear was a big part of that and, knives were a big part of that. And so I guess it was only natural that that was kind of the direction I went. It is kinda surprising to me, I guess, that I didn't check out a lot more traditional stuff with my, you know, growing up on a farm, you know, like, I can remember my grandpa, carrying slip joints. And my dad, every year when we would, you know, go deer hunting, he would get out this box of knives, and I was I still don't know where this thing is, but full of, you know, tons of classic hunting knives.

Jesse Jarosz [00:10:16]:
Uh-huh. You know, bucks, westerns, all the leather stacked handle, type stuff, brass guards, all that stuff. So I don't even know how old these things are, but, I distinct distinctly remember this box. Anyway, yeah. So, you know, I'm surprised that didn't play a bigger role in my, you know, early days of knife making, but the military probably was a big factor in that. And and tactical stuff, you know, back then was really popular, you know, with all the, the, military engagement we had around the world at that time. You know, is a lot more prevalent, I suppose, and it had a I think it had a big impact on culture in general.

Bob DeMarco [00:10:58]:
Let's talk a little bit about this box of knives your dad would pull out. I'm a big sucker. I mean, I go by the knife junkie. I love everything. It doesn't matter if it's a slip joint, modern, traditional. What was in that box, and, what was your dad's attachment to that kind of stuff?

Jesse Jarosz [00:11:17]:
Yeah. You know, I I couldn't give you any specific models, but it was a lot of I remember a lot of westerns. I can remember seeing the Tang stamp. And, yeah, just kind of a lot of those classic patterns, you know. All of them were pretty rusty or or had heavy patina. The leather just so, you know, dark from being used over time. It probably belonged to his dad, to be honest. I know he had a quite a few things that he kept from his dad that were passed down and, they probably have a lot of sentimental value to him, I'm sure.

Bob DeMarco [00:11:53]:
Well, I know that generations before us, and I think I'm a generation kind of ahead of you, but generations before us were, definitely looking at knives more as tools, and and we all do now too, but there's a a certain aspect of collectability and art and, you know, just love of the collection. And I think that that has expanded in recent years, but back in the day, people were really just using them. And this is my favorite knife for hunting because it, you know, it dresses a field dresses best or or what have you. But, in terms of the National Guard influence, when you were there, what were you issued, and and what do you think of what you got there?

Jesse Jarosz [00:12:41]:
The only issue knife we got was, it was, it's funny because I designed for them now, but it was a KA BAR knockoff. Oh. And it was horrible. I mean, it was so so bad. So I don't even know what, you know, what actual brand it was, but it was really bad from the sheath, you know, terrible terrible sheath. The knife was very janky overall. The leather handle was, like, rough and yeah. So that was the only issue thing.

Bob DeMarco [00:13:07]:
So you had sort of you were issued a KA BAR dupe, as my daughters like to call it, a fake. What what was that like, and and how did that inspire you to, you know, acquire something better?

Jesse Jarosz [00:13:20]:
Yeah. That was a it was a funny knife, and I don't know that is I don't know that it inspired me in any way. It was kind of a it was kind of a joke because everybody, you know, by that time, knew I was very into knives and I carried a lot of high end stuff, by then. And it was just kinda was, you know, something we made fun of a lot and, compared to, you know, nicer stuff we had. So, yeah. So you

Bob DeMarco [00:13:44]:
you were carrying high end stuff while in the military. My brother-in-law was a marine and he constantly had gear stolen. So he was like, don't ever bring anything. What were you carrying, and and how did you manage to hold on to it?

Jesse Jarosz [00:13:58]:
You know, I I wouldn't bring, like, a ton of stuff around just to, you know, store or, you know, keep my locker or anything like that, but I in my pocket, I always had, you know, probably an Emerson or a Henderer or something like that. So it was it was probably something like that, you know. At the at the time, nothing custom but higher end productions and probably like the, you know, the popular tactical things of that time. So

Bob DeMarco [00:14:25]:
alright. So we all know that knife making is not the easiest thing to, get into and then make a living at, certainly. So how how did your love of knives shift into your making them?

Jesse Jarosz [00:14:37]:
Yeah. You know, I've always had a tendency to like to make things, and I think I think it was just a curiosity thing. Right? I had I I had collected so many knives, prior to making and I guess, you know, it's it's been so long ago, I guess I can't pinpoint the exact motivators, but, I think it was just a curiosity of, you know, could I make something like this? Could I, you know, what what could I do with this, I guess? You know, what what am I capable of? And then once I actually started doing it, then the wheels really start turning because you see the potential there. You see, okay, this is how that works and and this is how this fits together. And, I guess, to me, you know, once I start getting into a hobby, it's like the floodgates open up. It's like, wow. I see all this potential and directions I could go. And, that's where the fun really began for me.

Bob DeMarco [00:15:37]:
Was it folders that you were most interested in jumping into, first? I mean, was that the end goal to make really awesome folders or, how did that fit?

Jesse Jarosz [00:15:48]:
At the beginning, I don't know that I actually had any sort of end goal. It was more, you know, this is something I can play with in my free time, and it was just fixed blades there for the fuse 1st few years. I don't know that I saw myself getting into folders. So I just made a lot of, fixed blades, you know. At the time, I I would have called them, you know, tactical or tactical inspired. I did do some hunting stuff as well, but they were they were pretty hideous.

Bob DeMarco [00:16:18]:
Well, you you mentioned, like, the expensive stuff. Sometimes I've heard and I've made a few knives here dabbling, and it was definitely inspired by this where I'm thinking, oh, I'm a creative guy, and I'm good with my hands, and I don't wanna spend all this money to fill out my collection. I think I could make something like a cherswala. Obviously, I couldn't. But but my my inspiration to to attempt it was to kinda save a little money, along the way. Was that, any did that have to do with it at all?

Jesse Jarosz [00:16:52]:
Definitely. That definitely played a role. I remember, you know, I was buying a lot of higher end productions at that time, you know, probably 3 to $500 range was my max, and that's still, you know, still a lot of money for a knife. But there were things out there that, you know, creeped up into, like, close to $1,000 and at at that time, that was just there's no way I could ever get my hands on something like that. So I think that was a a big inspiration where, you know, I see these extravagant knives or or things that are just out of reach for me and I'm like, no. What maybe I could make something similar or maybe I could, you know, get some of those materials and make something of my own. So I yeah. I do think that played a role.

Bob DeMarco [00:17:35]:
So when you finally got started, you know, you're collecting knives, you're loving knives, you're even using them, you grew up using them, How did you approach the making of them?

Jesse Jarosz [00:17:46]:
Yeah. That's a that's a good question. I guess I just wanted to make stuff that I wanted to carry. You know, it was just about my own my own needs at the time. I didn't really see myself making them for other people unless it was for a gift. So it was it was kinda, you know, what I saw the need for the knife. And at that time, you know, I collected so many things. I don't think I really understood what made a good knife even though, you know, I had, you know, lots of different brands and, you know, types of knives.

Jesse Jarosz [00:18:21]:
I don't think I I really understood everything behind what makes them work well. And, I think that's where I started to learn that is when I started making things, well, this, you know, this doesn't work or, you know, that doesn't feel good, a bit, you know, stuff like that. So the experimentation, you know, helped me learn a lot.

Bob DeMarco [00:18:41]:
Well, I know that you're you're known mostly for your high end folders and, your, you know, beautiful materials, very, high end finishing and and design. Tell me about your tell us about your process. Like, how did you get into actually making the folders, and then how has that evolved? I mean, we're looking at, Jim just put up some of your most recent stuff on screen, and they're so refined and so beautiful. I'm sure they didn't start like that. So how did how did your process begin, and and how has it evolved over time? By the way, I love that recurve. Beautiful. Anyway, so how did how did it start, and and how did you get to to here with the folders?

Jesse Jarosz [00:19:27]:
Yeah. Thank you, first of all. Those are very kind words, so thank you. And when I first started dabbling into folders, I think that's what kind of propelled me forward where, you know, I saw the the potential for this to be a career. I started posting, you know, the stuff I was making on the forums. And at that time, you know, even still to this date, folders are are the thing. Right? For the firm for, I would say, a larger part of the custom community, you know, folders really peep get people collecting and and that kind of thing. Yeah.

Jesse Jarosz [00:20:04]:
That maybe that's up for debate, but that's, you know, that's kind of the part of the industry I'm in, so that's what I see. But anyway, when I started making the folders, it got me a lot more attention, I guess, where people were wanting to get stuff from me. And, you know, with that, I guess my trajectory really changed and everything kinda shifted towards that because I saw it as a, you know, potential to make, you know, some side money or maybe even a career someday. And I got a lot more input from people on what they wanted and and ways I should improve and things like that. And so once I started making folders and dabbling in that, I think that really propelled my my knife making journey forward. And, I guess, the influences I had at that time, especially, being friends with Charles, I would spend a a lot of time with him. I would go over there, you know, quite a few times a year. And, funny enough, we would never really make anything together.

Jesse Jarosz [00:21:07]:
We we spent so much time in his shop, but I can I you know, maybe once or twice, I actually remember working in his shop, but we would just talk? You know, we would philosophize about knives. We would talk about other stuff. But, being in his shop and talking with him and showing him stuff that I made really shaped how I saw knives and what I value in a knife in a knife and, you know, the things that I, needed to work on, I I think really took hold with him.

Bob DeMarco [00:21:39]:
You mentioned the forums and, I feel like they're less a part of of the knife collecting thing right now. I think Instagram has sort of usurped that and YouTube and such. But, for people who might not know, what what was the influence and the the power behind all of these, knife form blade forms and knife forms, etcetera?

Jesse Jarosz [00:22:04]:
Yeah. You know, though I look at those that time with a lot of nostalgia, I do think the forms play a very different role now. They're not nearly as popular. You know, like you said, a lot large part of the community is just out on these social media platforms, which it is great because it allows us all to be connected and and there's a lot more information to sort through. But at the same time, I feel like it kinda decentralized, the community where, you know, at a time, you could kind of pinpoint places where there were groups of people, and you could get in there and interact. And it felt like it was easier to to develop relationships to me. Maybe that's not the case. I know there's there's still I meet people every year that I become close friends with and it's not through the forums, you know, but it just felt like it might have been easier then, and I felt like there were more get togethers and and things like that.

Jesse Jarosz [00:22:57]:
But the forums are really pretty special because not only did you have that community aspect, but you also had all that information kinda archived right there. So anything you talked about, any, you know, post that was made, pictures, all that stuff still exists out there. The, you know, the USN went through a server change, so all that's gone, like, Blade forms. You can sort through so much old information and, I think that's really cool and special and that's something we've kind of lost because you can't you can't efficiently search through Instagram. Right? It's very very difficult. YouTube, of course, you can go back, and that's great. And YouTube is YouTube is its own thing. It's I love YouTube.

Jesse Jarosz [00:23:37]:
Without YouTube, I I wouldn't be in the place I'm at. Right? There's so much to learn there. But I think we really lost something special with the forums, but that's just, you know, that's life. You know? Things come and go. But it was it was really cool to have all those people and all those resources and all that information kinda right there in that little spot.

Bob DeMarco [00:24:01]:
Oftentimes, I'll do searches on makers or or or what have you, and it will bring me back to Blade forums and that's where I first traded knives and bought secondhand knives and that kind of thing. And it's amazing to me. It is a, it is a, a, a historical archive for sure because everything has been maintained. I know they changed servers, but things didn't get wiped out for them for whatever reason. And, it it seems like a lot of information sharing happened there between knife makers and, and groups of knife enthusiasts. Oh, I I like Emerson. I like Strider. And then, there was a lot of interchange of information there.

Jesse Jarosz [00:24:40]:
Mhmm.

Bob DeMarco [00:24:41]:
Would you say that you, learned about the craft there without seeing you know, you mentioned YouTube. You can see what people are talking about. This is how I grind a blade or whatever. This is how I make a lock. But over there, it's all text. Did you still pick up a lot of stuff there?

Jesse Jarosz [00:24:58]:
Yes. And I think I think you just made a a huge point or or triggered a huge point for me where in those forums where you would, you know, post knife making tutorials or you would post a knife and ask for advice, it was a full on conversation. And now when you post something, yes, you have comments and there are conversations going on, but, I mean, people would write, you know, massive swaths of text over, you know, knife making or or anything, and you can't just you just can't do that in comment comment, format that we have now. So I think that's that's a big part of what we lost was that huge conversational element and it was so easy to reference, you know, this is what this guy said in response to that and, you know, it was a lot easier to organize and and read.

Bob DeMarco [00:25:47]:
So you mentioned that folders are the big thing with collectors, and I know that's coming from your perspective, because that's your bread and butter. But why do you think it's folders in particular that have, knife enthusiasts really,

Jesse Jarosz [00:26:04]:
enthralled? That's a good question. I think I think in the modern age with what we're making now and what's available, I think the mechanics of the thing play a huge role. The I don't know if it's totally fidget factor, but I think people like to have something they can open and play with and and feel this thing, you know, work, I guess. A fixed blade for people who love fixed blades and I am one of them. I have tons of fixed blades. You know, they're so fun to look at and you feel like the raw potential of this thing is like a working knife. Right? And there's some fixed blades that are absolutely insane art as well, but I think a lot of us think of fixed blades more of a as of a working knife. And, with the folders in the modern age, a lot of them do kind of blend that, you know, artistic expression with the functional side of things.

Jesse Jarosz [00:27:08]:
And I think a lot of people carry a pocket knife as something to admire just as much as they carry it to use, if that makes sense. And I think I think the platform or the, you know, the canvas, if you if you will, of a folding knife, it's a compact little thing, but you can express so much on it. Right? There's there's a lot going on there. So, I maybe not the most eloquent, response, but, I think those those are some of

Bob DeMarco [00:27:39]:
the reasons. Well, from a collector's standpoint, I've thought about this a lot, and part of it, is a practical thing. A lot of people don't feel comfortable carrying fixed blades, but you can have a whole trove of folders that you can pop in your pocket and have a bunch of different knives, one every day that's new and different, and and that's definitely an appeal. It's a practical appeal because you can carry them. But the other thing, and and something you just said just triggered this thought, is and this is not supposed to be a pun, but it triggered this thought. It's kind of like guns. My appreciation for guns, I like to shoot and it's fun and I have them for self defense, but they don't they don't, capture my imagination like knives. But the the crossover between a a, a gun and a folder is how perfectly made they have to be to be good.

Bob DeMarco [00:28:33]:
You know? You can't have a gun that has bad tolerances just like a knife with bad tolerances. You you'd rather not have it. You'd rather have a fixed blade. But I think that connection to me is a big part too. Like, there's engineering that goes into it, and there is no doubt in in in fixed blades, but it's a different kinda different kinda thing. Oh, okay. We're almost a halfway into this. Can you show us, the folder? I know you have a folder close at hand.

Bob DeMarco [00:29:02]:
Yeah. Let's take a look at this and talk about it.

Jesse Jarosz [00:29:05]:
So this is my Arkon model. This one, I've been carrying for well over a year now. So it's, pretty dirty, and you can see the pocket clip's really worn and scratched up. But this is, one of the few I did with a clip point blade.

Bob DeMarco [00:29:19]:
Oh.

Jesse Jarosz [00:29:19]:
And you can yet you can see it's very dirty.

Bob DeMarco [00:29:22]:
No. That's that wasn't the oh god. That was that is such a beautiful blade. If you're listening, a recurve clip point looks like it's got a hollow grind on it.

Jesse Jarosz [00:29:31]:
Yeah. Nice big tall hollow grind.

Bob DeMarco [00:29:34]:
So this is called your Arkon model. Tell us about it. What what goes into making a a a folder like this? So this

Jesse Jarosz [00:29:45]:
this, knife, it's one of my older designs that just kinda got, reimagined. I I came out with it early on in my folder days, and then the design kinda got shelved for about a decade. I just came brought it back out, last year, and it's really almost a totally different knife, but it still shares those, familiar lines, I think. But as far as what goes into something like that, so, all of my folders, I would consider to be handmade with some machine, you know, you know, CNC's type assistance. So I get my locking liner in the blade cut out as blanks, and then everything else I do by hand. So I'm cutting out stuff on the band saw, you know, shaping it on the grinder, all manually, all that stuff. So, I would say, you know, 90 plus percent, handmade with a little bit of assistance from CNC just to help me, you know, boost efficiency a little bit. Sure.

Jesse Jarosz [00:30:41]:
And yeah. You know, I I really, credit a lot to, Charles Marlow with giving me the eye I have for the things that I care about in a knife. And, I really think I have a fairly, simplistic style. You know, I don't have a lot going on on my knives and I really try to focus on the fundamentals and just make a very fundamentally sound knife, you know, from the way it actually works and functions to, you know, taking in the aesthetics of it. I just like nice clean designs and clean execution and and that's, you know, that's what I care about and what makes me happy in a knife. Right? Of course, I do experiment from time to time and and, you know, throw on a stainless steel blade and bolsters and and, you know, way crazier materials than I put on my standard knives. But, you know, for me personally, that's what I I get joy out of is the the nice fundamentally sound, clean look and, you know, practical, type of knives.

Bob DeMarco [00:31:46]:
Well, what are the things under the hood that have you, that that take extra effort? I mean, you mentioned Charles Marlowe kind of, cultivated some of those some of those things. What are they?

Jesse Jarosz [00:31:59]:
Yeah. You know, there are things I think people often overlook until you maybe compare knives up close. Like, if I, you know, take one of my earlier knives and compare it to something I make now, you'll obviously see it, you know, and feel a lot of changes. But, there's a lot of just subtle things and, not gonna be able to show you too well on camera, but, you know, from the symmetry from side to side on the contour of the scales, like, is the the corner here, is it perfectly symmetrical from side to side? And from, you know, front to back, is it uniform? The blev the bevels, you know, are they uniform and symmetrical? Finishes, you know, are there any any stray scratches, things like that. The action, obviously, you know, you can feel whether or not an action is good and if something is sloppy or loose or, you know, if there's play somewhere there shouldn't be. Those are all things you can feel. So it's just making sure, you know, aesthetically, things are are lining up, you know, as close as possible. You know, the the goal is perfection but, nobody can make things exactly perfect.

Jesse Jarosz [00:33:06]:
Right? But, it's really just trying to make all those little things as perfect as I can. And, you know, it's yeah. It's a lot of, it's a lot of work and a lot of frustration sometimes, but it's it's worth it to me.

Bob DeMarco [00:33:23]:
I mean, I I I think that there is, like, this, misconception that that, say, you have a design, you create it in CAD, you put it into a CNC machine, and it's gonna spit out a perfect knife. I know I know that even in that process, there's a lot of, not just hand work, but brain work to make tolerances work, to make things work. But but when you're doing it all by hand, I would imagine that it's a it's a it's a huge learning curve. I mean, you want this thing to feel perfect, like you said, and it will never be perfect, but you can get there. You can get as close to perfect as, you know, as is humanly possible. It seem it seems like when you when you're doing everything by hand, each time it's a rediscovery.

Jesse Jarosz [00:34:14]:
Mhmm. Yeah. Definitely. You know, I have a I have a lot of admiration for guys who do stuff with CNC too. I think it's just a different tool in the toolkit, and there's a whole different skill set there that I don't even, you know, understand. But, yeah, it it is, you know, each one brings you new lessons and and things you know you can improve on the next one. And something I really enjoy is I usually do small batches of knives. So, you know, 3 to 5 is kind of my sweet spot.

Jesse Jarosz [00:34:41]:
Sometimes I'll do more. And when I do that many, it feels like I learn a lot more because I'm doing, you know, the same thing, you know, 5 times in a row. And it's like, okay, this one right here, you know, the first one in the in the line, I'm I did this little thing I wish I did better. Well, I have 4 more opportunities right now to make that improvement. Whereas making one at a time, you know, some of those some of those lessons I think get forgotten or it's like you you remembered after you already did the thing. So, you know, if I make a knife, this week and then, you know, 3 weeks later I make the a similar knife, a lot of those lessons aren't fresh in your mind. Whereas, you know, in a batch, it's like, okay. Right here, I get the chance to make that improvement.

Jesse Jarosz [00:35:26]:
And, that's something I really like in in my process.

Bob DeMarco [00:35:31]:
I think, and tell me if I'm wrong, but I think makers like you, probably have, a well, an ever growing, but a stable of collectors, people who love your stuff. What do they expect from you and a Juros custom knife?

Jesse Jarosz [00:35:49]:
That's a really good question. You know, I think they expect functionality first, I would say. I think, you know, having the knife come very sharp, be mechanically sound, the lock's not gonna fail. You know, I think they're gonna expect that's something that they can actually use and trust. And then, you know, second to that, or maybe it's right up there, it's it's hard to say I guess, but, is those those fundamentally sound features, you know, the uniformity, the symmetry, all those little little details that I really try to get right and, you know, like I said, I'm not perfect. There's always things I can improve on and it's fun to me to have someone who's been collecting my stuff for a while or or has handled something a few years ago and gets to handle something now, especially when it's the same model and say, hey, I noticed these very subtle changes you made and I appreciate them. You know, it's it's cool to me to to see that, progress recognized, I guess. So I think maybe another part of that is is expecting, the progress and, you know, that's a lot of pressure too.

Jesse Jarosz [00:37:04]:
So Yeah. Yeah. Because the, you know, the more progress you make, the harder it becomes to make it. But it's it's fun to see, you know, people recognize those little improvements.

Bob DeMarco [00:37:15]:
So when I was, perusing your website, figuring out how how one lands a a Juros and you have a number of lines, and we're gonna talk about that too. But, how does how does one get a custom handmade, Jesse Juros knife? I noticed you have a lottery system. Tell us about that a little bit.

Jesse Jarosz [00:37:35]:
Yeah. The lottery system is probably the most prevalent of my methods of selling. So I have a I have a website, of course, where, you know, you had it pulled up on the camera here a moment ago. And what I'll do is, I have this nice plugin that allows me to run a lottery. And so basically what that is is you go to my online store and you add the, you know, you go to the lottery and you add this knife to your cart, basically. You're not buying anything, it doesn't cost you anything, but you're you're going through and checking out. And then what that does on my end is it enters you into an automated lottery system. So everybody who purchases an entry here, the the program sorts itself out, picks a random winner at the cutoff time that I set, and then it's published there, in the lottery so, you know, people will know number 13 or whatever it is won that knife and then, you know, I go on and and make the communication from there.

Jesse Jarosz [00:38:34]:
So it's a nice automated way of doing things because when I do, you know, a batch of 5 knives, it's it can be confusing and difficult to, manage 5 different conversations at once with, you know, multiple people. So if I can automate a large part of that, it makes it a lot easier. And I think it, makes a lot less frustrating on the collector side too because things can be, you know, pretty tense when you're, you know, did I win? You know, what's going on? Or is the maker rigging it? You know, that kind of stuff. So this takes a lot of those unknowns out of the, equation for me.

Bob DeMarco [00:39:09]:
It seems like it makes it a lot more fair to people who have and forgive this expression, but but for people who have lives and who can't be, like, hovering over the refresh button, when you when they know you're gonna drop something. It kinda seems to level the playing field a little bit. And like you said, I would imagine, there might be sour grapes. Oh, Jesse always sells to that guy, you know, Bob DeMarco 22. Why not me? But it it's luck of the draw, and I think that that that's, that's a good way to do it, especially when you're when you're machine, you know, with with machine assistance, hand making knives, you can't be just, like, pumping them out, pumping them out. Mhmm. But you've you've done some things to, up your efficiency in terms of output. Tell us about your various lines that you have.

Jesse Jarosz [00:40:01]:
Yeah. You know, a large part of that efficiency thing, like you said, with the the, you know, machine assistance, having those couple blank parts cut, really saves me a lot of time because, you know, the those eliminate just sitting on the band saw all day cutting out, you know, however many parts. It's, to me, that's just something that my time is better spent doing, you know, putting putting the sole in the knife, you know, grinding blades, cutting on handles, contouring, that sort of thing. But as far as the different lines I have, obviously, you know, there's my full blown custom stuff and there's the, you know, what frankly, more people might be familiar with my KA BAR line because they're a lot more, you know, they're producing a lot more knives than I can and KA BAR is, you know, an absolute, legend of a company and I'm so privileged to work with them. But, there are a couple other things I do, not as much, but I I try to do little projects here and there where I might outsource, a large part of, like, a fixed blade, where I'll have handles CNC machine and maybe the blades ground and things like that. And then I'll do, you know, some of the fitting and assembly in house. It's not something I do as often right now. I do have my eye on a couple projects in the near future that I hope to get to like that.

Jesse Jarosz [00:41:22]:
But, yeah, you know, I try to offer, different price ranges and different, I guess, forms of manufacture in order to achieve those, price points and, quantities, that are available.

Bob DeMarco [00:41:36]:
So what's it like for someone who's, you know, a hand maker or, you know, a, well, you you make custom handmade knives, and then you go from that to someone like KA BAR, who can is a legend, and I love KA BAR, and how they mass produce stuff. What's it like going from from that where you you can scrutinize every detail of something you make in your shop, but you can't do that with them? You're handing over a design. Tell us about that.

Jesse Jarosz [00:42:08]:
Yeah. You know, there's something I didn't realize till later on in the relationship, with KA BAR, and that is that production companies, you know, not just KA BAR, every every company has a process that is unique to them, you know, and even when it comes to knifemakers. You know, how I make a folder is probably different than most other folder makers. And and majority of the stuff we do is is shared, you know, it's similar, but there are, you know, subtleties in everybody's process that separates us, and production companies have that too. So when you design something for them, so now when I design, you know, it's different than when I first started where I'm considering their production capability and their process, because you have to kinda understand their process in order to to design something. Because if if you give them a design that they don't have the processes for, well, they're gonna modify that design and fit it into their line the way they can. And maybe that product doesn't end up how you imagined it. Right? So you need to take that into consideration so that, you know, the, I guess, the melding of the 2 brands is as perfect as it can be.

Bob DeMarco [00:43:27]:
Yeah. So a KA BAR isn't gonna retool their entire giant facility for for one design that that you might send away. So, from from your perspective, what do you think, KA BAR gets, like, so right about your knives in particular?

Jesse Jarosz [00:43:43]:
You know, this is, something I've thought about and I think we share a very similar philosophy. And if you look at the the KA BAR lineup and you look at what I make, we both make, very straightforward user oriented knives. You know, the the fixed blades of mine they've produced and the folders they've produced are very, you know, straightforward. There's nothing crazy. I'm not trying to revolutionize the knife, not putting out wild, you know, shapes or features. It's straightforward, and I think that's, you know, that's something that KA BAR has always done. You know, the the knives some of the knives they've produced have been produced forever and, you know, you look at, like, the Ethan Becker line, he very much shares the same philosophy. The TDI stuff is very, you know, oriented in that, self defense, you know, application.

Jesse Jarosz [00:44:35]:
I think we just share a very similar design philosophy and, that's why we're so compatible.

Bob DeMarco [00:44:43]:
That's interesting that you say that because earlier you mentioned that, even in your custom work, you know, the the the real unique selling proposition of your custom work is is the design, but also how well they're made and and how, how labored over they are. But and yet they're they're simple. You said simplistic. I would say simple, and and that's just, mincing words. But to me, simple is is is beautiful if it's done right. And, that that is, a hallmark of Kaybar. You know? They've been doing things the same way for a long time, it seems, and they produce knives of a certain ilk, even when they're, collaborating with with someone like yourself or Ethan Becker, and and those have been some of the most successful knives out there, you know, these these kabars. You mentioned on your website that, you design or you make knives for Montanans or or or people who are going to really rely on their knives.

Bob DeMarco [00:45:51]:
So what did you mean by that?

Jesse Jarosz [00:45:53]:
Yeah. So, you know, I make, I make a lot of different things. You know? Right now, I'm more focused on folders than anything, but it really it really gives me good feelings when I can make something for someone and it's put to use and it serves a real role in their life or in their job or whatever it is. So, you know, not just Montanans, you know, I'm here and I I have a lot of friends who do some amazing stuff in the backcountry, you know, working in, you know, as a first responder, things like that. And I love getting knives to those those types of people when I can. So, yeah, it's, you know, just people and not just Montanans, but, you know, people anywhere who are doing something where a knife plays a big role in it. It's, it just really really you know, it's everything I stand for. Right? It's it's, providing something useful and, the yeah.

Jesse Jarosz [00:46:56]:
Stumbling over my words here, but it's it's really making a tool and the tools getting used.

Bob DeMarco [00:47:01]:
Yeah. I mean, I I knew from reading that that you didn't mean just Montanans, obviously. I only give knives for people in Ohio. You're not gonna you're not gonna say that. But but what I took that to mean is, you know, obviously, you're look. If if you're on your website and you see the knives, you you can see that they're beautiful and refined and and very well considered. But the Montanans part is, to me, like someone who actually relies on their knives. I collect them.

Bob DeMarco [00:47:27]:
I love them. I I view them almost as art, functional art. But someone who's, living out on the frontier, so to speak, or or going deep deep, in the back country can rely on these things, as well as, the the the, guy who who is appreciating them for their aesthetic. Oh, wait a sec. I didn't realize this. Sorry to interrupt myself. But as Jim is scrolling through your your work, I see you use, like, a is that a top liner lock? What is that?

Jesse Jarosz [00:48:01]:
Yeah. That's the Spyderco compression lock. Yep. So I've, I've used that for, I think, over a decade now, and it earlier when I was using it, it was something you licensed from Spyderco, you know, they own that lock. Their their life their their patent has since expired, and it's it's free game, but if you call it the compression lock, which I do, you need to reference Spyderco. So I always, you know, make sure it's the Spyderco compression lock. So, yeah, that's a, you know, it's a really fun mechanism that I've always loved. And I saw a need for it in the custom market, and, that's something that's a a regular part of my lineup.

Jesse Jarosz [00:48:40]:
I don't know of too many other guys using it at the time. I think there might be 2 or 3. So, yeah, it's a it's a fun mechanism, one that I really enjoy. And and, you know, speaking from experience with my, you know, little market, people really enjoy having a custom with that mechanism. It's it's got a nice fidget factor. It's a very sound lock and, yeah. Do you

Bob DeMarco [00:49:05]:
do you think it's more sound than a regular liner lock, especially if if you're using your folder for hard work?

Jesse Jarosz [00:49:11]:
I do think there is benefits to it. You know, whether or not it's more sound, I think, theoretically, you know, I can hypothesize that it is. But, you know, the way it works, is that lock bar is being sandwiched between the lock face and the stop pin. And when you apply more pressure to the spine of the blade, it's compressing that lock bar, so it's grabbing it. Right? Whereas a aligner lock or a frame lock, there's nothing grabbing that lock bar, you know, you're applying pressure in the and if the if the geometry is wrong, the lock is gonna slip. Right? So it's it's, it's forcing that lock bar away from it, whereas this is actually grabbing the lock bar. So, I can hypothesize that it might be stronger. I can't actually tell you.

Jesse Jarosz [00:50:01]:
I do test my locks and and, you know, whether whether or not it's a compression or a liner lock, I I make sure that that thing's not gonna fail. You know, folders are prone to failure no matter what. Not saying, you know, there's not a scenario where it couldn't. You know, things get dirty, stuff gets in there. If you don't want a knife to fail, you should use a fixed blade, that kind of thing. So, you know, yeah.

Bob DeMarco [00:50:22]:
Well, that's interesting because, really, the liner lock and the I'll I'll say the liner lock because the frame lock, you have your hand that's sort of reinforcing it. But with a liner lock, it it is really relying on surface tension and and and the designer's knowledge of geometry. And if I'm the designer, you're in trouble because I'm terrible at that. But but that that concept of, of having the, lock being kind of bitten into on that long axis will, I I yes. Seems like it will totally strengthen it, you know, much greater. But, you know, you should probably not be using your knives, that are folders that hard that that's a consideration, you know. But, you know, some some of those low low speed, high speed, low drag folks, might might disagree. But, so let's talk a little bit about fixed blades.

Bob DeMarco [00:51:26]:
One of the someone recently sent me a picture of your, double edged commando knife, with the red handle, and, I think you called it a a commando knife. And that thing was so gorgeous. I'm used to your folders, and I love the way they look. But when this one was sent to me, I was, oh

Jesse Jarosz [00:51:45]:
my god.

Bob DeMarco [00:51:46]:
Who made that? And then I saw your name, and it blew me away. Tell me about, your fixed blades. Do you how frequently do you work on those? Do you make those? And and what's your design philosophy around your fixed blades?

Jesse Jarosz [00:51:59]:
Yeah. I I I love fixed blades. Like I said earlier, I have quite a big collection of them. My design philosophy around fixed blades is typically just straightforward user oriented, stuff. I don't do a lot of bells and whistles fixed blades. The commando is kind of an exception, you know, it's I would say, it's still it's still on that theme as far as the execution, but that thing is is, to me, basically a fantasy knife. Right? It's something that it just it's cool. It gets your imagination going when you're holding it.

Jesse Jarosz [00:52:32]:
It's just a really fun knife, and it's kinda my expression of my love for knives. Right? It's like you hold this thing, it's just like, wow. This is this thing's crazy. So that's, you know, that's where the commando comes from. But as far as my, you know, standard fixed blades, I I try to make them when I can. Obviously, you know, folders are are where my demand is, and so that's where, you know, I'm, you know, focusing more of my efforts. But, I do like I do like to make fixed blades when I can and, when I do it's it's usually user oriented, you know, very, you know, practical type stuff. And actually I do I, I do have one here.

Jesse Jarosz [00:53:10]:
It's not quite finished. I have to put my maker's mark on it. And it's not a super pretty one because I'm making it for a friend to use as a, a camp, kitchen knife for, you know, when he's camping, so I didn't make it super special, but it's a Christmas gift for him. There's one of my little, yeah, kitchen knives.

Bob DeMarco [00:53:30]:
So yeah. That is gorgeous. And if you're if you're listening, it looks to me like a like a a cross between a kiridashi and a sax, but it's a kitchen knife, kitchen camp knife, man. That is beautiful.

Jesse Jarosz [00:53:44]:
Thank you. Yeah. And you can see, I mean, it's it's got very, simple lines, nothing crazy, very straightforward handle, nice and contoured and soft, edges. So it'll be comfy comfy. It's thinly ground, so it should cut, well and should be fun to use, hopefully.

Bob DeMarco [00:54:01]:
I wanted to well, before I get to this, one of these last couple of questions here, just to describe, Jim had the commando knife up. It's a beautiful I think it's an 8 inch blade and double looks double edged, or ready for double edge.

Jesse Jarosz [00:54:17]:
Some of them are. Some of them aren't.

Bob DeMarco [00:54:19]:
Yes. Oh, I got you. The one that I would get would be for sure. But I wanna talk a little bit about materials. What what what are your preferred steels? I I know your handle materials pretty much, but, tell me about the steels and and your heat treat.

Jesse Jarosz [00:54:35]:
Yeah. I, when it comes to steel, you know, having something that's reliable is probably the biggest, you know, factor for me, and there's so many great steels out there, nowadays. But I'm using a lot of MagnaCut, you know, it's the popular thing, but it's, it's it's been a pleasant steal for me to use as a user. Right? As someone who's using knives, I'm I'm quite impressed with it. And then I really enjoy AEBL. It's been around forever, and I think it's finally getting the attention and respect it deserves. If you go back, you know, we're talking about forums. There's a lot of debate, like, 10, 15 years ago about the, validity of AEBL on larger knives like machetes, and some, you know, people were saying it's just it's a razor blade steel, you know, it serves no use in this realm.

Jesse Jarosz [00:55:25]:
And now we're finding out AEBL, is probably, if not, you know, one of the, if not the most tough, stainless steels we have available. And, so it's cool to see, you know, that the actual data come out on that and, prove what a lot of us who've used it, already, you know, kind of knew or felt like we knew to be true. So I I really love A EBL. It's a pleasure to work with too as a knife maker, a lot easier than MagnaCut. And then if I if it were more available, I think my favorite steel is Super Gold 2 and, it's just not something that's available to US makers. You can get it, but the places you get it from typically have very low quantities and it's outrageously expensive. So your best shot is to try to find some at a knife show or maybe if you're, you know, overseas, they send it they send it to Europe sometimes, but they don't send to us. So

Bob DeMarco [00:56:24]:
Who makes super gold too?

Jesse Jarosz [00:56:26]:
Takafu in Japan, and I've used a number of their other steels. And, you know, as a as a steel manufacturer I have nothing but good things to say. Their their steel is incredibly clean, and, yeah, Super Gold 2 is is just, it's a beautiful steel and it's a great user steel, so I wish it were more available. So if Takafu is listening to this, send me Super Gold 2.

Bob DeMarco [00:56:51]:
Alright. Before we wrap, I wanna ask you kind of a, well, it's a question that only someone such as yourself who's been doing this for 15 years can answer. How how have you seen since you started, the knife world evolve in terms of design and,

Jesse Jarosz [00:57:09]:
demand? Yeah. It's it's been a whirlwind. You know? I've seen a couple different, phases, I guess, in what I would call you know, I think the tactical market was heavily, laying heavy on folders towards the end there, and I think that is kinda what morphed into what we would call EDC now. Mhmm. And I've I've seen that transition, you know, from from very tactical to more, artistic folders. Right? And there's been some other, you know, sub subgenres, you know, or whatever you wanna call them that kind of popped up in between. Yeah. It's it's just very interesting to see, you know, we have, the production capabilities now.

Jesse Jarosz [00:57:54]:
Actual production companies, have really popped up in the past few years. There's a lot more companies and there's a lot more, nicer knives that are available now. And so I think the market is very competitive in that side of things. There are also a lot of custom makers, I think a lot more now. I still like to think that custom guys aren't necessarily competing with one another as much, though there probably is some aspect of that. But, you know, I think if if you've done your due diligence as a maker, you've probably, sort of created your own style and and reasons for people to buy your knives and collect your knives. So, I don't like to think of competition so much, you know, from my side of things, but I think on the production side, it's very competitive and, I don't envy those bigger companies. Right? I mean, they have a lot to to compete over.

Bob DeMarco [00:58:50]:
Yeah. And and it's really, from my perspective, a collector's market, especially if you collect production. Mhmm. Before I let you go, Jesse, tell, viewers and listeners the best way to keep keep up with your work and and how they can, get behind the wheel of the Jesse Juros.

Jesse Jarosz [00:59:08]:
Yeah. Of course. So if you're trying to buy something, I think the best way to get the news on my drops and my lotteries would be to sign up for my newsletter. I do wanna put out more info in my newsletter eventually when I have the the time, to do so. Hopefully, I can rope my wife into helping you with that someday. But for right now, it's it's specifically, you know, focused on knife drops and and when I put out new stuff or or a drop or whatever. And then the, the other methods, of course, are, you know, your social media. So I've got a Facebook group.

Jesse Jarosz [00:59:45]:
You can go over there. I'll post a lot of lot of, like, work in progress, updates, things like that. Of course, I'll I'll share my night drops there too. And occasionally, I'll do an exclusive, like, group lottery, things like that. So that's a, you know, fun reason to be there. And then Instagram is my largest platform that I I have, you know, where my largest portion of my following is. And I I see Instagram for myself as more of a interactive gallery. I don't, put too much effort into, you know, creating content per se.

Jesse Jarosz [01:00:18]:
I just like to share my photos and videos of knives there and then it's it's to me, it's the easiest place for people to connect. So, you know, they see a picture, they might have a question, it's very easy to DM me and then we'll have an interaction and I really enjoy that, that aspect of it. So

Bob DeMarco [01:00:34]:
Well, Jesse, thank you so much for joining me on the Knife Junkie podcast. It's been a pleasure meeting you and finding out about you. I've always heard your name and been familiar with your work, but it's really cool to meet the man behind the knives. So thank you so much for showing up.

Jesse Jarosz [01:00:48]:
Yeah. Thank you. Thank you for having me. It's been a privilege, and, I'm very grateful to be here. Awesome. Take care, sir. Thank you.

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You know you're a knife junkie if you're as happy as a kid on Christmas morning when that new knife arrives in the mail.

Bob DeMarco [01:01:08]:
There he goes, ladies and gentlemen. Jesse Jarreauz of Jarreauz Knives. Also, he he met mentioned all the different places you can keep up with his work and and get his work, but I also recommend checking out Kbar if you wanna just dabble and really, you know, feel feel what the basic designs feel like in hand. Don't forget that Kbar has its entire, Kaybar Jaros line, so you can check it out there. Alright. For Jim working his magic behind the switcher, I'm Bob DeMarco saying until next time, don't take dull for an answer.

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