The Knife Junkie Podcast is the place for knife newbies and knife junkies to learn about knives and knife collecting. Twice per week Bob DeMarco talks knives. Email Bob at theknifejunkie@gmail.com; visit https://theknifejunkie.com.
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Announcer [00:00:03]:
Welcome to the Knife Junkie podcast. Your weekly dose of knife news and information about knives and knife collecting. Here's your host, Bob The Knife Junkie DeMarco.

Bob DeMarco [00:00:16]:
Welcome to the Knife Junkie podcast. I'm Bob DiMarco. On this edition of the show, I'm speaking with custom knife maker Jeff Schafer. I first got wind of Jeff to through Rolando Escutada and the big beautiful Bowie chopper that he featured on his channel right After Blade Show 2025. Jeff's work features classic American knife profiles made by hand with attention to detail, balance and performance. Jeff is a martial artist and a man of adventure whose custom knives have caught the eye and attention of some of the finest practitioners and trusted voices.

Bob DeMarco [00:00:52]:
Of the bladed martial arts.

Bob DeMarco [00:00:54]:
We'll meet Jeff, check out his work and hear about his career in knife making. But first, be sure to like, comment, subscribe and hit the notification bell so you can download the show and listen on the go. You can put that on your favorite podcast app and all please. Also, if you'd like to help support the show, you can do so by going to Patreon and seeing what we have to offer there. Quickest way to do that is to head on over to the knife junkie.com/again. That's theknif junkie.com Patreon red your.

Announcer [00:01:25]:
Adventure delivered. Your monthly subscription for handpicked outdoor survival, EDC and other cool gear from our expert team of outdoor professionals. Theknife junkie.com/battlebox .

Bob DeMarco [00:01:38]:
Jeff welcome to the Knife Junkie podcast, sir.

Jeff Schafer [00:01:40]:
Oh, thank you. Thanks for having me on.

Bob DeMarco [00:01:43]:
Oh, it's my pleasure. It's really good to meet you. Rolando spoke very, very highly of you. The man and also the, the big Bowie chopper that he, he got from you. Let's just start there and then we'll go back and, and find out who you are and you got here. But that knife. Describe that knife.

Jeff Schafer [00:02:07]:
I. It's just a really big chopper knife. It's ADC RV2 steel, got a convex edge, a sharpened clip and.

Jeff Schafer [00:02:20]:
I can't.

Jeff Schafer [00:02:20]:
remember what the handle was right now, but it's got like some nice wood handles on it.

Bob DeMarco [00:02:27]:
So the thing that really struck me about that knife is, well, first of all, I'm a sucker for a sharpened clip. Anyone who's watched this show for any length of time knows that, but also not used to seeing a sharpened clip on a chopper style knife like that. And when I think of a chopper, it's, it's what you were, what you made there. Something where the guard itself is the Wideness of the blade.

Bob DeMarco [00:02:52]:
Right?

Jeff Schafer [00:02:52]:
Yeah.

Bob DeMarco [00:02:54]:
How do you come up with that design?

Jeff Schafer [00:02:56]:
Well, it's, it's kind of inspired by a Jerry Fisk knife that he's made a long time ago and I had an order for one so I made couple.

Bob DeMarco [00:03:10]:
Yeah, Fisk. I know, I know that Rolando's a collector of him and, and, and like that. But so, so a knife like that, a chopper you don't think of as something that's going to move around as well as it does. Tell me about, tell me about the, the making of that and the kind of considerations you had going into that. Obviously it's a fighting knife. It's not necessarily like a, a go out in the woods and baton firewood kind of knife.

Jeff Schafer [00:03:39]:
Right. It can, it can be used as a fighting knife or you know, a woods chopper. You know, if you get attacked by an animal in the woods that could help really well. But the, the sharpening clip is really good for the back, back cuts and it's got a nice distal paper so, so that it's not super tip heavy even though is, it is heavier than a specific made for fighting knife. It's a little bit more weight forward than that. It will chop really well on two bars and any kind of limbs and stuff like that.

Bob DeMarco [00:04:17]:
So how'd you get into this? How did you get into knife making?

Jeff Schafer [00:04:21]:
Well, a long time ago when I was in high school, I bought a really cool double edged knife and I took it to school back in the 80s and a friend saw it, liked it more. He paid me double for what I paid for it. So I thought well I'll just make another one because I have, I have books on making knives and I tried but it was terrible. It was just like from a little pile and of course I had to do a double edged knife for the first knife and it was, it was terrible. And had a piece of two before for a handle and so I put that on the back shelf until I got married and moved to a house where I could have a shot. And so as soon as I got my shop built I was ready to start making knives.

Bob DeMarco [00:05:10]:
So I, I was. Where was the Arizona custom knives or somewhere where. I was reading a little bit about you and you mentioned something about your grandma. We hear a lot about grandpa's and that's where who I got my first knife from. Tell me about your grandmother.

Jeff Schafer [00:05:26]:
Well, my grandma, she had this little. Well I say little is about this long butcher knife that it was real cheap and wouldn't hold an edge. It had Hollow scales on it, like plastic scales. And she would like take, take the knife and put it down beside her leg and say, here, you can go play with it. I was like in the low mid single digit age and I don't know if she was trying to get, just get rid of me, let me go play or let me go hurt myself. But my mom really didn't like it, but she didn't say anything to her. And so that's where I really got playing with. I would go ask her for that knife every time we go to their house and I go outside and I would throw with it whatever, stumps, birds, anything that came along.

Jeff Schafer [00:06:19]:
And it was, it was just a lot of fun for me when I was a kid.

Bob DeMarco [00:06:24]:
Yeah, I think, I think you and I are similar generation. I was in, I graduated from high school at the very end of the 80s and back then, you know, we were a tougher breed. We, we were, we were talking for lions, right?

Jeff Schafer [00:06:39]:
We would just, we would just go out in the middle of the summertime and camp on the river for two or three weeks, you know, just wow. A few of our, our kids, you know, in like the 10, 11, 12 year old range, we would just go out there and camp and fish.

Bob DeMarco [00:06:55]:
Where, whereabouts were you?

Jeff Schafer [00:06:57]:
Northeast Arkansas.

Bob DeMarco [00:06:59]:
Arkansas. Okay.

Bob DeMarco [00:07:00]:
Yeah, well, I was in Bourbon Cleveland, so we didn't get as much as, as Arkansas. You were about to say something.

Jeff Schafer [00:07:05]:
I'm sorry. Uh, it's just we got, we got five rivers here in the county, so. And, and a guy knew, one of my friends knew a guy that had some river property. So we were back there on private property and, and his mom and dad would come out, check on us every once in a while.

Bob DeMarco [00:07:23]:
So you mentioned you had a, a Gerber, like double edge. And, and I know you didn't mention Gerber, but I remember reading that and you sold, you sold it to your, your friend at school and then decided, hey, I'll make one, right? You said you had knife books laying around already. So how did that come about? I mean, was it from like your grandmother's kind of encouraging it or how.

Jeff Schafer [00:07:50]:
Yeah, well, you know, she's, she started to spark. And I would look at all the really custom made knives from back in the era and I love those really nice buoys with the walrus handles and the nice guards and even Damascus back then. Was this really getting popular as far as I can remember. And I thought, well, the only way I'm ever going to be able to afford one of those is to make it myself. But Turns out it would have been cheaper for me to buy some knives the then build a shop. But anyway, this is a lot more fun.

Bob DeMarco [00:08:29]:
Well, yeah, thank God you didn't because we wouldn't be talking right now. So martial arts, what. What kind of role did martial arts play or do martial arts play in your life? The.

Jeff Schafer [00:08:42]:
I was very deeply into it for a very long time and I'm kind of out of it now because there's just. All I do is make knives now. But I started out in tang soo do right out of high school and later on got into the bujinkan and some screamer. And towards the end of my career as a martial artist, I was doing Brazilian jiu jitsu.

Bob DeMarco [00:09:14]:
Okay.

Bob DeMarco [00:09:14]:
All right. So escrima, that's I. That's the intersection of knives and martial arts to me though. I don't know what you said. Is it something about Buddha?

Jeff Schafer [00:09:25]:
It's a. It's a jab. Really old Japanese martial arts.

Bob DeMarco [00:09:29]:
Is that also blade oriented?

Jeff Schafer [00:09:32]:
It's weapon oriented, yes. It's like swords and we got weird sticks and chains and stuff like that. Oh, back in the 80s that it was. What was the, the all the incapacity ninja. They. They marketed it as ninjutsu.

Bob DeMarco [00:09:51]:
I got you.

Jeff Schafer [00:09:52]:
Yeah, not really. It was mostly samurai.

Bob DeMarco [00:09:55]:
Okay. So escrima, that's what I'm most familiar with. I've. I've done a bit of. Well, I did a bunch of Kali for a long time, but same like you kind of been out of it for a little while. As far as like regularly practicing though, I practice around here. I just have no one to. Just a bob dummy to hit, but.

Jeff Schafer [00:10:15]:
That'S what I do. Yeah, yeah.

Bob DeMarco [00:10:17]:
I mean, you know that. That's is better than nothing.

Jeff Schafer [00:10:20]:
You gotta swing the stick some. Yeah, yeah, exactly.

Bob DeMarco [00:10:23]:
Well, how much did Filipino martial arts encourage you? Or inspire, that's the word I'm looking for. Inspire you in your knife making Quite a bit.

Jeff Schafer [00:10:35]:
I, I love the Baron for one thing and just all the martial arts weapons are really cool. I like the butterfly knives and the Chinese side of things. I never studied that with anybody, you know, but those are basically giant Bowie knives. But I, I got a lot of inspiration from them. I still haven't made them barong yet, but I want to.

Bob DeMarco [00:11:08]:
Yeah, I'm thinking just knowing that the chopper and seeing how beautiful it is and it's a big. Your, your bowie chopper, the one we were talking about earlier, that's a pretty big knife. Looks like maybe a 11 inch blade or something.

Jeff Schafer [00:11:23]:
Well, it's 12 inches, 12 inch blade.

Bob DeMarco [00:11:26]:
You're. You're approaching that, that short sword area though. I know I say that and people like, oh, short sword. I know it's got to be bigger than that. But still, you know, that Barong. I've seen Barongs that are somewhat small, you know, and then, yeah, they get larger. That is one of my favorite all time blades.

Jeff Schafer [00:11:44]:
Yeah, it just looks like it got a lot of power out there in the meat of that blade.

Bob DeMarco [00:11:51]:
Yeah, yeah.

Bob DeMarco [00:11:52]:
And the handles too, I got. This is my favorite. I have a couple of Barongs that. This one right here is one of my favorites.

Jeff Schafer [00:11:59]:
That is really cool.

Bob DeMarco [00:12:01]:
So is this something that you're considering doing sometime in the offing here?

Jeff Schafer [00:12:07]:
All right. Yes, it'll probably be in the next year though. And you know, unless I get an order or something. Right now I'm focusing on the A.B.S. journeyman Smith test.

Bob DeMarco [00:12:21]:
Oh.

Jeff Schafer [00:12:22]:
So I'm trying to, I'm trying to do that. I said it out loud. There it is. For some reason, every, every year something happens and I don't actually get pickled. So I'm planning on this year making a solid stab at it.

Bob DeMarco [00:12:38]:
Oh, that's good. So that's, that's at Blade Show Atlanta, right? That's where they.

Bob DeMarco [00:12:43]:
Right, okay.

Jeff Schafer [00:12:44]:
Yeah.

Bob DeMarco [00:12:44]:
So what kind of prep are you doing to become a journeyman?

Jeff Schafer [00:12:48]:
Well, first off, you gotta, you gotta pass the performance knife test, which is a 10 inch blade with. And it has to be able to chop a 1 inch rope, 1, 1 swipe, chop through 2, 2 befores and then bend. Well, then shave, gotta be shaving sharp after that. And then it's got to bend 90 degrees without breaking.

Bob DeMarco [00:13:18]:
That's crazy.

Jeff Schafer [00:13:19]:
It is.

Bob DeMarco [00:13:20]:
So is this a knife that you've already made or is this.

Jeff Schafer [00:13:25]:
I've made a few. I'm gonna make another one. Got one. One more to make. And then I'm hoping to test like next, next month.

Bob DeMarco [00:13:31]:
Okay.

Jeff Schafer [00:13:32]:
For the performance test, you got to do that first. And then whenever you go to Atlanta, you got to take five presentation knives that are just, you know, as perfect as you can make them.

Bob DeMarco [00:13:44]:
Well, for the testing, for the performance test, you're not doing the test though, are you?

Jeff Schafer [00:13:48]:
Oh, you do? Yeah, you do. You do the cutting and everything.

Bob DeMarco [00:13:52]:
And what do they do? What do you do? Videotape yourself and show it off or.

Jeff Schafer [00:13:56]:
Oh no, you go to a master bladesmith shop.

Bob DeMarco [00:13:59]:
Oh, okay. Yeah.

Bob DeMarco [00:14:00]:
And do you have someone already picked out or lined up?

Jeff Schafer [00:14:03]:
I. I do have a guy. Can I say his name? Sure, yeah. Tad lynch, he lives about a hour and a half, two hours from here and I've contacted him but it's been a little while and so I got to get back with him and try to get that test set up.

Bob DeMarco [00:14:24]:
Okay, so, so all right. We can assume from the fact that you're, you're going for your journeyman, you want to become a journeyman, that you are forging blades.

Jeff Schafer [00:14:34]:
Yes.

Bob DeMarco [00:14:35]:
So there is a huge process of learning there how tell take us through that. I mean the first knife you made was a file and you were trying to approximate a double edged Gerber boot knife or something like that.

Jeff Schafer [00:14:50]:
Yeah.

Bob DeMarco [00:14:51]:
And here you are now ready to, you know, ready to go into your journeyman testing. How did you take that journey?

Jeff Schafer [00:15:00]:
Well, mostly know I learned from books but I went to a lot of hammer ends to watch Master Smith. Like here, here in Arkansas. We have a really good school down there. The, in Old Washington is where I went most of the time and it has now moved over to Texarkana. But twice a year they have a hammer in where they do demonstrations and there's always a foraging, always, always grinding and a heat treating demonstration. And then there's other stuff, you know, as the mastersmiths want to do, wanted to show. So I've been doing that for about eight years.

Bob DeMarco [00:15:45]:
So you've learned a lot. Picked up a lot. Only eight years. I'm sorry, wait a sec. Really?

Jeff Schafer [00:15:50]:
Yes, I've been forging, you know, I've been learning to forage and stuff for about eight years.

Bob DeMarco [00:15:54]:
Wow. Okay.

Bob DeMarco [00:15:55]:
For some reason, just, I guess the reason is the work I've seen you make. It seems like you've been doing it longer.

Jeff Schafer [00:16:02]:
Oh, I appreciate it.

Bob DeMarco [00:16:03]:
Yeah.

Bob DeMarco [00:16:04]:
Yeah. So here's.

Bob DeMarco [00:16:06]:
Okay.

Bob DeMarco [00:16:07]:
I, I, at some point I always say like when I retire I'm a handy guy and I'm also kind of an artistic guy and there's a lot of untapped potential in me and, and, and a lot of that is because a lot of my artistic pursuits tapered down when I had a family and, and you know I do this show and I do a couple of other little things but at some point, and I always say in my retirement because I do have a day job, I, I want to throw myself into knife making just because I've dabbled a little tiny bit, but never with forging. What would you say to me if, if I were to tell you like, yeah, that's got a really, that's got to wait because of all the equipment and the, and the noise and is that true or am I just holding myself up?

Jeff Schafer [00:16:54]:
No, you know, it's a little bit of a, an expense to start out with and it, if you wanted to ease into it, you could just start doing stock removal knives. You got to do that anyway. After you forge a knife, you got to do some stock removal. And some knives are just better for stock removal than forging. And so get a grinder and a drill press and everything else you can, you can go from there with and then do a few knives, you know, whatever has as. As funds allow. Get a, A nice. You could build a forge.

Jeff Schafer [00:17:37]:
I built my forge and I also built my grinder, but you could get an anvil and start to go into hammer ends and learn. Because it's much better to learn from somebody that knows what they're doing. It'll save you so many headaches to go and learn how to, you know, forging a point on a blade that can be persnickety at times.

Bob DeMarco [00:18:02]:
Yeah.

Jeff Schafer [00:18:02]:
And just learn the whole process.

Bob DeMarco [00:18:06]:
So were you always a handy person?

Jeff Schafer [00:18:09]:
Yes, I always, Always. My dad, he was, he was real handy. Anything he, he had, he built some little crafts and stuff, but he would always be working on the car and doing maintenance on the car and, and working on the lawnmower or whatever. He built the back half of our house when I was a kid. So I was there in the middle of all that. And I just, you know, I just think you can probably build whatever you want to build, you know, if you, if you really want to do it. And, and if you learn from books really well, which I'm sure you do, because you're a bookish person, you know, you said, and you can learn just about anything from, from books. But nowadays there's so many videos online that's.

Jeff Schafer [00:18:53]:
Or some of them aren't very good, but there are, you know, you can, you can, you can learn a lot of stuff. A lot of Master Smiths have content out now. That's exceptional.

Bob DeMarco [00:19:04]:
Who, who, who do you like?

Jeff Schafer [00:19:06]:
I like Kyle Royer on his. He, I, I get his, like, I get his courses online courses and I. Let's see who else. I got some more that are. Jason Knight. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. He's got some good classes out online and they also. Almost all, all mastersmiths will help you out.

Jeff Schafer [00:19:39]:
You know, for the most part. I, I haven't met one that's not really nice and loves talking about knives, you know.

Bob DeMarco [00:19:47]:
Yeah.

Jeff Schafer [00:19:47]:
In the abs, you're. If you're close to one of those guys, you can go visit Them and learn a ton in just a little while.

Bob DeMarco [00:19:54]:
So there, there's a connection actually, may as well just draw it right now. There's a connection between you and one of the founders of the abs and I'm thinking, and this might be the long way around, but Bill Bagwell, right, He was one of the founders, right? And I know that James Keating loved Bill Bagwell knives and he also loves your knives. Right James, Tell us who James Keating is and how did you get involved with him?

Jeff Schafer [00:20:26]:
Well, James Keating is a very long time martial artist who was back when I was a kid, he was on the COVID of Black Belt magazine. He had so many videos and stuff out. I had used to, whenever I'd be sitting at my computer I would have, I had a list hanging down off my bookshelf that, of his videos that I wanted, you know. And so we got together through a buddy of mine, David Benefield, he teaches at FLETC down in North Carolina. And I turned him on to James Keating and he went and trained with him and then he said, hey Jeff, James needs a, needs a knife maker. His knife maker is leaving him and said, wanted to know if you start. And that was right when I was first getting started. So there's a lot of work for me to get a knife fixed up and sent to him and let him check it out.

Jeff Schafer [00:21:26]:
And he liked it. So we've been, we've been making his knives ever since.

Bob DeMarco [00:21:31]:
So. Okay, all right, so you say, all right, there are a couple of things here, but first. Okay, the first, the thing is his knife maker left. So he's got his. So James Keating, master at arms. So he's, he is the man when it comes to bowie knife fighting. I know that.

Jeff Schafer [00:21:48]:
Yes.

Bob DeMarco [00:21:49]:
And I can presume that he's a lot, a lot of other stuff, right?

Jeff Schafer [00:21:52]:
Well, yeah, pretty much all swords, handkerchiefs, guns. He's really good with guns too. And he's, he's, he's made, he's made it several knives over the years that were custom made and he's got like his, the little stinger that you. I got one somewhere, but I don't know, I didn't think about it that you put in, in your hand, you know, and it's like a. Kind of like a plastic push dagger. Yeah. You know that he, he invented that and got a bunch of those that.

Bob DeMarco [00:22:25]:
He sells and, and he invented and designed. So first of all, I think it's just so cool to have your own knife maker. Oh, I have, I have my, my guy who Makes all my knife ideas, but he had that. Is it the court? Not the cortado.

Jeff Schafer [00:22:40]:
What is it called?

Bob DeMarco [00:22:42]:
That long double edged fighting knife?

Jeff Schafer [00:22:45]:
The. The crusader crusada.

Bob DeMarco [00:22:48]:
Yeah, right.

Bob DeMarco [00:22:50]:
I know, he designed it. Do you make that for him now?

Jeff Schafer [00:22:53]:
Yeah, I make it for him. And all I have are some trainers, something like this, about this size, as you can see. And this hole is for quillians that come out. So when you're looking at it, the quillions will stick out like this. And that's where the cross, the croissantic name comes from.

Bob DeMarco [00:23:13]:
Hold, hold that up if you would.

Jeff Schafer [00:23:15]:
Okay. It's, this is my own one that I trained with, so it's a little.

Bob DeMarco [00:23:20]:
Bit beat up, but.

Bob DeMarco [00:23:22]:
Okay. So it's got the, it's got the big guards there and it's got a Spanish notch.

Jeff Schafer [00:23:26]:
Right.

Bob DeMarco [00:23:28]:
And what's that for?

Jeff Schafer [00:23:30]:
It's for catching blades. Kind of like that. We really lock in there. And if you look at the design, the tip of this quillion feeds, feeds the blade into the, the notch. So this slides down and then it catches in there. It can also work in the back. It'd be used as, you know, a disarm. You know, it's hard, it's hard to use.

Jeff Schafer [00:24:00]:
And for me, I mean, he knows.

Bob DeMarco [00:24:03]:
He knows how to do it really well.

Jeff Schafer [00:24:04]:
Yeah.

Bob DeMarco [00:24:06]:
And I love the look of that knife. I think that's one of the coolest knives I've ever seen. And the idea of those little quillians that screw in through the center right there.

Jeff Schafer [00:24:18]:
Yeah. This is the buoy model. I haven't made any of the double edged ones, the spear point ones. It's got a slight recurve right here and it's made for fat cutting and, and fighting.

Bob DeMarco [00:24:35]:
That's so cool.

Bob DeMarco [00:24:36]:
So, okay, before we got started, you showed me a bowie of your own making that I made for a friend. Can you show this off and talk about it a little bit?

Jeff Schafer [00:24:46]:
Okay. This knife right here. Yeah.

Bob DeMarco [00:24:51]:
That is so cool.

Jeff Schafer [00:24:53]:
A buddy, he contacted me and he wanted, he wanted a knife, you know, the Louis Lamour. There's a, there's a, there's a character in there called the Tinker. And he, he's a knife maker, a martial artist and knows languages and stuff and he makes the best knives. So my buddy said, hey, would you make me a knife that the Tinker might make? And Louis Lamour and I go, okay. So I checked it out and this.

Bob DeMarco [00:25:21]:
Is.

Jeff Schafer [00:25:23]:
1084 steel with a mild steel forged guard, a sunset bronze spacer, and a Crown stag crown handle.

Bob DeMarco [00:25:36]:
Oh, God, that's so. Okay, hold, hold it up so we can see it.

Bob DeMarco [00:25:39]:
Yeah, there you go.

Bob DeMarco [00:25:42]:
So this, this an interesting. So it's a long, sort of slender Bowie profile. It doesn't have much of a curved clip at all, but it's got. It looks like that clip is sharp.

Jeff Schafer [00:25:55]:
Is that right? It is, it is sharp. Yep. I don't like, you know, dough clips either.

Bob DeMarco [00:25:59]:
Yeah.

Jeff Schafer [00:26:01]:
But I made the sheath. It's a, it's a sheath that goes, that fits in between your belt and the belt comes along and snags right there. So you can put it in your gun belt and it just sits there. You can put it cross draw or however, however way you want to do it.

Bob DeMarco [00:26:22]:
I, I love that knife. I gotta say. Totally. I love that knife. That giant S guard is pretty impressive too. How does it. When you're, when you're using it, how does that fit in the hand?

Jeff Schafer [00:26:35]:
You see, there's, there's plenty of clearance for your fingers and it's, it's almost like a D guard. So any, any blades comes down this way. It's pretty good. You got a pretty good hand protection there. And this is, this top part is good enough that you, you could possibly catch a blade with it or whatever.

Bob DeMarco [00:27:01]:
Oh, yeah, I see what you mean. Like you got a blade sliding across the spine and you twist it.

Jeff Schafer [00:27:06]:
Yeah. Lock it up like one of these coming down here like this and then.

Bob DeMarco [00:27:14]:
Yeah.

Bob DeMarco [00:27:15]:
So what, what is the, what are the knives that people come to you for? I, I would imagine you're not always making tinker bowies or the giant choppers. What, what's your real Brett and Butter style of knife?

Jeff Schafer [00:27:27]:
Well, probably a hunter. I got, I got. I, I was trying to get one done for you. I made a bunch of these, but I, I didn't get it finished. My, my friend back when I was doing jiu jitsu, he has his own school now. And so whenever he, whenever he gives a new belt, a new person, what's that called, Promotes a person, he gives them a knife. One of my knives. So I, I make a custom knife for him and he, like right now I'm g.

Jeff Schafer [00:27:59]:
Making a brown belt knife. We, we started out originally with these little knives here for the, the blue belts. You can see maybe.

Bob DeMarco [00:28:13]:
How cool.

Bob DeMarco [00:28:14]:
Yeah, we can see that beautiful little clip point looks like a mini fighting bowie. But you've got the blue pins, right.

Jeff Schafer [00:28:21]:
And it's got a blue liners.

Bob DeMarco [00:28:22]:
Oh, that's so cool.

Jeff Schafer [00:28:24]:
And I call it the baby buoy.

Bob DeMarco [00:28:26]:
You know, but baby boy, that's the.

Jeff Schafer [00:28:30]:
One we first started with with him making these little knives, and now I've sold a bunch to law enforcement, you know, because they like the thin blue line. And this one made for my, my mother in law. I don't know if you can see it, but it's pink.

Bob DeMarco [00:28:49]:
Put your hand behind it. We might see the color better.

Bob DeMarco [00:28:52]:
Yeah, there we go. Oh, that cool.

Jeff Schafer [00:28:55]:
It's pink with the white liners.

Bob DeMarco [00:28:59]:
Love how those are.

Bob DeMarco [00:29:00]:
Let me ask you a question about the jiu jitsu knives. Okay. So this isn't like taking taekwondo at the mall. You're not, you're not getting a new belt every week. And I don't mean to be dissing taekwondo or anything like that, but, but, but Brazilian Jiu jitsu is notorious for the length of time between each belt, so it's not like he's giving these things away all the time.

Jeff Schafer [00:29:21]:
No, not all the time, but he has given out quite a few of them. And I think it took me, I went one day a week and it took me almost three years to get my blue belt. So, you know, that's your first from the white belt.

Bob DeMarco [00:29:39]:
So as, as they progress, did the, did the knives get larger?

Jeff Schafer [00:29:45]:
Yes, we, we haven't made a black belt one yet.

Bob DeMarco [00:29:47]:
Okay.

Jeff Schafer [00:29:48]:
We, we've talked about it and it might be, it might be a bowie knife, so we don't know for sure on that yet.

Bob DeMarco [00:29:55]:
Wow, that's pretty cool.

Bob DeMarco [00:29:58]:
So with the, with, with your progression of your ability to knife fight and use a bowie, what have you learned from working with James Keating on, on his knives? What kind of things have you learned about knives that you, you maybe didn't think about before you were working with him?

Bob DeMarco [00:30:18]:
I don't really know.

Jeff Schafer [00:30:19]:
He, he has had a lot of insight in the, the knife industry and some general business stuff. Like somebody would buy something from him and they would tell PayPal that they didn't get it, you know, and so they got scammed. He. PayPal would give their money back and then they, you know, if it was a knife or something, he, he would be out as a knife too. So he still need to watch out.

Bob DeMarco [00:30:48]:
For that kind of thing, man.

Bob DeMarco [00:30:50]:
I mean, you would think knowing who this guy is, you wouldn't mess with him because they, these things called airplanes, you could get on one and go find that guy.

Jeff Schafer [00:30:59]:
Exactly. And he's got your address.

Bob DeMarco [00:31:03]:
But in terms of knife design for what, what his purpose is, you know, I'm, I'm presuming you're making him fighting knives. Well what are the knives you're making him right now?

Jeff Schafer [00:31:14]:
Well, all I have are trainers. He has a sub hilt that you can see. These aren't forced or anything. These are a water jet cut and but this is, you know, he's, he likes the trigger on there. Whenever he, he has a specific purpose for the trigger. If you go learn from him, he will teach you how to use it in the, the knife fighting perspective. And but this is a trainer. I got one.

Jeff Schafer [00:31:50]:
You know, I have one that's bead blasted. It might not glare as much.

Bob DeMarco [00:31:53]:
Oh wow, that is, that's crazy.

Jeff Schafer [00:31:58]:
But it's a neat, it's a neat little knife. It's kind of, the blade is sort of like a Randall number one.

Bob DeMarco [00:32:04]:
Yeah.

Jeff Schafer [00:32:05]:
And then his handle is, it comes down pretty good ways here where it's like a pistol, almost like a pistol grip so that the alignment of your hand.

Bob DeMarco [00:32:17]:
Oh, I'm bleeding.

Jeff Schafer [00:32:19]:
Alignment of your hand is, is, you know, in line with the thrust and a sharpened clip so that you can back cut with it too.

Bob DeMarco [00:32:29]:
That looks smaller than what a lot of his knives tend to be. At least that I know of.

Bob DeMarco [00:32:37]:
Right.

Jeff Schafer [00:32:38]:
He's had this one out for a while, a pretty good while. And but the, there's several people who every day carry this even though it, it is, it's big knife but it's not nearly as big as the Cassada. Right.

Bob DeMarco [00:32:59]:
So in terms of making a knife that's meant for fighting balance, this is something Rolando for instance was talking about. He talks about that a lot and he's a, if, if people don't know him, they, they need to check out our many conversations on this show. I love he's a great guy but also he's very interesting to talk to about the specifics of knife fighting and he frequently talks about the balance of a knife. And with my limited knowledge I can, I can feel how a well balanced knife or a knife that's balanced for the purpose is superior to, to another. When you're making a knife say for James Keating or just in general a knife that you consider to be a self defense or a fighting knife. What goes into it in terms of that aspect of the design, the balance and the feel.

Jeff Schafer [00:33:51]:
Okay. Like the, the, the big chopper that Rolando has that has a forward balance for, for chopping and but the, the croissanta, I make these to balance right here in the quillian. This is the aluminum version so it doesn't, doesn't really balance. But right here in the Quillion so that it's fairly lightweight at the tip. So the tip is really fast and whenever you put the quillions in, it doesn't change the balance.

Bob DeMarco [00:34:25]:
Oh, that's smart.

Jeff Schafer [00:34:26]:
So that's why I like on this one. That's what I worry about. This one is a little bit light in the tip as well because there's quite a bit of meat in the handle. So they're quick.

Bob DeMarco [00:34:41]:
So do you test out your work?

Jeff Schafer [00:34:43]:
I do, yes. I test out on everything because I have, let's see, I like to chop into either some micarta or I, I've got a piece of a persimmon tree that persimmons really hard and maple. Some of the maple can be soft pine trees. You know the pine lumber pretty soft. I, I test those specifically for. To make sure that I heat treated it because I have forgotten to heat treat one. I've. I've made a couple of knives and then whenever I, I just did a little thing like that and bent the edge and I'm like well start over.

Bob DeMarco [00:35:26]:
Oh, that's got to be brutal. You. So you can't just pop the handles off and heat treat it?

Jeff Schafer [00:35:32]:
No. Once you grind it thin enough to be a knife, whenever you heat treat it, the, the, the edge will wave like this, you know, at. And so you have to grind that all off and by then it's a completely different knife.

Bob DeMarco [00:35:48]:
Okay, so this reminds me of another topic. My wife and I are huge fans of Forged in Fire. And I understand you recently competed on that.

Jeff Schafer [00:35:58]:
Well, it was, it was recently aired. I, it was filmed four years ago.

Bob DeMarco [00:36:05]:
Oh geez.

Jeff Schafer [00:36:06]:
Okay. Yeah, yeah, they, they had a bunch in the can that they, you know, like 25 to 30 shows that the, they had filmed but hadn't aired and mine was one of them. So on season, at least on our TV season 12, episode one, they finally released. Released that.

Bob DeMarco [00:36:27]:
What, what was the challenge knife? The, the.

Jeff Schafer [00:36:31]:
It was a machete.

Bob DeMarco [00:36:32]:
Machete.

Jeff Schafer [00:36:33]:
First. First round machete. That's the. At my what. There may have been some more big room ones since the, since you know, since you know before mine but not that I had seen at the time. So mine was the biggest knife that for the first round that I had seen and I was like, oh my goodness.

Bob DeMarco [00:36:55]:
This was the Pimp My Blade episode in My Blade.

Jeff Schafer [00:36:57]:
Yeah.

Bob DeMarco [00:36:58]:
Gosh. We just watched that and I didn't even know who I was watching. How crazy is that?

Jeff Schafer [00:37:02]:
Yep. Yep, that was me.

Bob DeMarco [00:37:04]:
It's awesome. So what was that experience like?

Jeff Schafer [00:37:07]:
It was awesome. I loved It. I would. I would go back again anytime. It was. It was really fun to see how it was made and everything. I had a whole lot of fun. Got to meet some cool guys and just make knives.

Jeff Schafer [00:37:23]:
It was. It was very fun.

Bob DeMarco [00:37:25]:
So working in the. On the. I mean, I'm not sure if it's a sound stage. It seems like it's a warehouse or something.

Jeff Schafer [00:37:34]:
Yeah, it's a warehouse.

Bob DeMarco [00:37:36]:
What's that place like?

Jeff Schafer [00:37:39]:
Well, it's really cool in the back area. You come through the back, and you stage back there. And whenever I was getting ready to go on, we have guys that stay with us the whole time so that there's no possibility of cheating going on. They take. They take the competition very seriously. And so one of the guys goes, okay, Jeff, whenever I say Action Jeff, you go out. And I said, oh, from now on, I'm gonna have everybody just call me Action Jeff, you know, and he goes, and. But I got out there the very first thing I did, you know, and they cut this out.

Jeff Schafer [00:38:18]:
But the first thing he did was, you know, Grady was like, hello, Jeff. Welcome to the forge. And I was like, hi, Cody.

Bob DeMarco [00:38:26]:
Sake.

Jeff Schafer [00:38:26]:
And I. Who's Cody? And every time I looked at one of the cameras, I was thinking, there's a million people looking at me.

Bob DeMarco [00:38:34]:
So what. What's the hardest part about competing on that show?

Jeff Schafer [00:38:39]:
Probably time. Worrying about the time, you know, Definitely the time. You can't make a really nice knife in five hours, right? And so you got to make a nice enough knife and try not to rush yourself, which is what I did and caused my problems. But, you know, whenever I got done with the forging the blade, I had, like 20. 20 minutes left. I thought, wow, I could have. Could have done some. Something else.

Jeff Schafer [00:39:08]:
I didn't realize that I was done that fast, but I did get it. Get it finished.

Bob DeMarco [00:39:13]:
So what did you do before the show? Before you. I know this was four years ago at this point, but what did you do leading up to it to prep yourself?

Jeff Schafer [00:39:22]:
I made a list of things that I wanted to practice and to experience before I went to the show. And they. They had a question there, and they like, have you ever done this? Have you ever done coal? Have you ever made a crossbow? Have you made stuff like that? And I didn't practice making a Costco, but I did go practice. I don't have a hammer, a power hammer or a press. And so I went to a friend's shop and used his to make some Damascus and that sort of thing. Just make sure I knew What I was doing when I got out there and did that, that's.

Bob DeMarco [00:40:00]:
So is that something that you plan on investing in at some point, like a big.

Jeff Schafer [00:40:04]:
Oh, yeah, definitely. So when I retire, the.

Bob DeMarco [00:40:07]:
When you retire. Okay, so the, the. Is the press the same machine as the hammer?

Jeff Schafer [00:40:13]:
No, they're two different machines. The press just squishes for like 25 tons or more. You can get smaller ones and it's really great for making Damascus. Any kind of Damascus you can use that. The hammer is just beef like that. And it's great for forging out blades. You know, you can forge them out and you can also do certain types of Damascus on those as well.

Bob DeMarco [00:40:40]:
Okay, so those, those presses. And they have those cool dieses that, that sort of press in. That's for getting your welds together.

Bob DeMarco [00:40:48]:
Right, right.

Jeff Schafer [00:40:49]:
Getting them, getting them, getting them there. You can, like, if you put like you, you had it like, like this, you can squish from the corners of the blade and make C's and W's to make all kinds of different patterns with that. But you. You're right. Whenever. Squish. But you can do. You can do the, the squishing to the initial weld on the hammer too.

Bob DeMarco [00:41:14]:
Okay.

Bob DeMarco [00:41:15]:
Okay. Is this something. Do you do Damascus regularly or.

Jeff Schafer [00:41:19]:
Not regularly, no, I, I just. Whenever I go to my friend's house, I'll make some. But it is, it's on the list. Right now I'm getting prepared for retirement. I got a year and a half to maybe two years, and so I'm getting stuff for the house. Retirement funds ready to go. But as soon as I retire, I'm going to be hitting some classes with the master smiths and getting the tools that I need for the. The press and maybe a hammer.

Jeff Schafer [00:41:56]:
What.

Bob DeMarco [00:41:56]:
What line of work are you retiring from? You don't.

Jeff Schafer [00:41:59]:
I am a letter carrier. City carrier.

Bob DeMarco [00:42:01]:
Oh, okay.

Jeff Schafer [00:42:02]:
Post office. Yeah.

Bob DeMarco [00:42:03]:
Oh, we are. We all. Thank you. Especially knife junkies such as myself who. Who rely on good folks like you.

Jeff Schafer [00:42:11]:
To bring our little addict the knives back and forth. Right? Yeah. Yeah, exactly.

Bob DeMarco [00:42:15]:
You know what? I'm going to knock on wood, but it's. I remember when I first.

Jeff Schafer [00:42:21]:
I mean, I've.

Bob DeMarco [00:42:21]:
I've been into knives since I was a little kid, but when I really like, I. I feel like it was 2012 or 2013 when it really picked up for me and I started online and trading and mailing and people always used to complain about the post office, and I was like, geez, knock on wood. I've never had me too.

Jeff Schafer [00:42:40]:
I've never had, I've never lost a knife either coming or going, either way. And I have had some like a T shirt or something get lost in the mail, but nothing too, too bad.

Bob DeMarco [00:42:54]:
Yeah. Yeah.

Jeff Schafer [00:42:54]:
Which for like about 18 years I was my own mail carrier. So at least that last, that last mile, I knew I was going to get it then.

Bob DeMarco [00:43:02]:
Yeah. Yeah, man, that's, that's a lucky, that's.

Bob DeMarco [00:43:05]:
A bit of luck there.

Jeff Schafer [00:43:06]:
Yeah. For me, if it, if it makes it to my post office, I'm going.

Bob DeMarco [00:43:10]:
To get it, you know. Yeah.

Bob DeMarco [00:43:12]:
So I found something else about you and I'm not stalking you, but I had to do some research.

Jeff Schafer [00:43:19]:
Right.

Bob DeMarco [00:43:19]:
It said that you are a cold case murder investigation blade expert. What is that all about?

Jeff Schafer [00:43:27]:
Well, they. I got a friend who, who is a reporter and he has, he's covered a lot of cases here, Northeast Arkansas, so like the, the West Memphis Three and Rebecca Gould. Those are, they made national headlines and he's written books about them and stuff. And he combined with an investigator who came from the military. I'm not a hundred percent sure of all her background, but she has a, she's really good investigative, just, you know, investigator. And they had a, had a, a case where someone was stabbed and they just needed to like, wanted to learn as much as they could about the knife that might possibly have done it. So they brought me in and I consulted with like three or four cases for them. Now what's that like? It's pretty interesting, you know, do that to be able to view autopsy photos, but otherwise you get to like, just play the scenario over and over again, look at the wounds and see what kind of knife could have caused that.

Jeff Schafer [00:44:42]:
You know, this. It was pretty, pretty interesting.

Bob DeMarco [00:44:48]:
Yeah. I could see that being interesting and you know, at the same time. Well, kind of. I could see how it could be a difficult thing to, to manage. I guess you have to have a strong stomach, but.

Jeff Schafer [00:45:00]:
Yeah, yeah. And you know, you get to play over all the scenarios of what happened whenever, whenever the person was murdered. The last, I don't know if I'm supposed to talk about all specifics, but the first one that I did, it was fairly, fairly easy to see that it was a certain particular knife. And the others are probably more like just kitchen knives.

Bob DeMarco [00:45:31]:
Okay, so the first one, and I'm not going to press you for details you can't give, but are you saying that the first one had a, a profile? Like a wound profile, for lack of a better term, that was easily identifiable as a certain Type of knife.

Jeff Schafer [00:45:45]:
Right. And you know, you could see like where he hit bone and the knife didn't, didn't stab down a very deep. You can see it was a double edge.

Bob DeMarco [00:46:01]:
Oh, okay.

Jeff Schafer [00:46:02]:
And then the deeper it got, and some of the, the ones where he got way, you know, just buried it to the hilt. It was a fat on one side and the edge on the other side. So it had a double edge at the front of the blade and a single edge at the back. And it was fairly thick but pretty narrow. And so that led me to believe that it was most likely so something like a, a World War II trench knife.

Bob DeMarco [00:46:30]:
Oh, like an M3?

Bob DeMarco [00:46:32]:
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Jeff Schafer [00:46:34]:
And that was the only. I, I scoured all my books and on the Internet and I could not find a knife that had that blade profile that was that narrow, like three quarters of the inch wide and was very thick in the back and double edged.

Bob DeMarco [00:46:49]:
Right, Man.

Bob DeMarco [00:46:52]:
So I, my question, I think you pretty much answered it. In your experience, is it usually people doing bad stuff with everyday knives, like kitchen knives?

Jeff Schafer [00:47:03]:
Yeah, yeah. Most of the is sometimes they're hunting knives. But, you know, like, if someone really gets mad, a lot of serial killers will go into a house without any weapons for some reason. I don't know why, but in my study of serial killers, they would go into the house and find a weapon like they would do a lamp cord to choke somebody. There was famous cases of that and that. And once he found out that that worked, well, that's what he did from then on. And some of them go in there and get a knife out of the kitchen. And so usually it's something from inside the house that they use.

Bob DeMarco [00:47:42]:
Jeez, man.

Bob DeMarco [00:47:43]:
That's. This is, you know, tapping into some of my biggest concerns because I have a lot of these kind of implements in my house. I have a lot of other kind of implements to defend the family. But, you know, I always think about that. It, it pops into my head all the time. Like I got all these knives around, right?

Jeff Schafer [00:48:05]:
Yeah.

Bob DeMarco [00:48:05]:
But then again, I also think if someone were in this house, you know, hopefully they'd be met with a wall of flying metal.

Jeff Schafer [00:48:16]:
Yeah, exactly.

Bob DeMarco [00:48:18]:
And so, you know, I don't know, I don't even want to think about that kind of stuff. But it's, but it is very interesting to me to, to, to know that, you know, you're, you're kind of working on all sides of, of knives in the making. The making of some very specialized knives.

Jeff Schafer [00:48:37]:
Right.

Bob DeMarco [00:48:37]:
For some people who specialize in them, like James Keating. And you've done Forged in Fire. That's pretty cool. I also understand that you are a pilot.

Jeff Schafer [00:48:51]:
I did take lessons. I'm not a pilot now, but I took lessons. I went all the way. Took the written, made a 97 on my written. And that's the only thing I can brag about. But I didn't actually go take my final flight lessons. I. That was when I was in my 20s.

Jeff Schafer [00:49:11]:
I got about 75 hours in, and I love flying, but it was just getting too expensive at the time. I didn't have a good job, and so I had to quit about the time I was getting ready to take the test.

Bob DeMarco [00:49:25]:
Okay, so with. With all of these things, with, with your love of history and of knives and all this, what are the kind of knives that you see yourself making in the future as. As you continue, you know, you retire, you throw yourself even deeper into the. Into knife making and forging. Where do you see this going for you in the. In the terms of the types of knives you'd like to make?

Jeff Schafer [00:49:53]:
Well, the types of knives I like to make are bowie knives and, and daggers. And I really would love to make just a lot of really nice ones, you know, with Damascus engraving, checkering on, you know, stuff like that. I. I've taken. I've taken engraving classes.

Bob DeMarco [00:50:15]:
Oh.

Jeff Schafer [00:50:16]:
And. And so that's definitely in the future, and I hope to make some really cool knives. And later on, I'm making as good a night as I can make right now.

Bob DeMarco [00:50:28]:
Daggers present a special challenge, I would imagine. I cannot imagine. I mean, I can imagine making a really sweet Bowie in. Because I can see how I would do it, even though I don't know what I'm doing, but I have no idea how one would make a dagger. What are the. What are the special challenges?

Jeff Schafer [00:50:46]:
The, the biggest challenge with the dagger is symmetry. They have to be the same, not only just in one side to the other, but they got four sides, so. And they all had to be perfectly same. And then the guards have to be straight and symmetrical as well. So that's the biggest challenge of making a dagger, is symmetry.

Bob DeMarco [00:51:12]:
Have you, have you seen the daggers that, that they make? Mastersmiths, when you go for your mastersmith test those kind of daggers.

Jeff Schafer [00:51:20]:
Yeah, with the, with the tweet.

Bob DeMarco [00:51:23]:
Yeah.

Jeff Schafer [00:51:23]:
Wire inlay. Yeah. That's all. That's all a thing that you have to do to. That's one of the things is that it's the quillion dagger and it has to have a fluted handle with the twisted Wire inlays in the handle and I think at least a 300 layer blade Damascus blade.

Bob DeMarco [00:51:45]:
That's crazy.

Bob DeMarco [00:51:46]:
Do you, do you do, do you see any. I've, I've wondered this sometimes, especially when watching forging fire. We keep coming back to that, but in the, in the making of Damascus steel and is there any compromise to the, to the strength when you have two different steels and you're welding them together? Let's just assume all the welds are perfect, you know, and, and that's not the concern.

Jeff Schafer [00:52:13]:
Okay. Yeah. If they're all perfect and done. Done well, there's not really any, any less strength.

Bob DeMarco [00:52:20]:
Okay.

Bob DeMarco [00:52:21]:
Yeah.

Jeff Schafer [00:52:23]:
You know, there's a lot of, lot of little layers that, you know, there's a lot of opportunities to go bad in Damascus making Damascus, but there's not really. Once it's all basically one piece of metal, it should be pretty strong for a knife.

Bob DeMarco [00:52:42]:
Okay, so before I let you go here, you showed me a hunter before, before we started rolling here. I'd like you to show us that. And then, and then I also want to see the, the big Bowie again, the whole camera.

Bob DeMarco [00:52:57]:
This looks beautiful, right?

Jeff Schafer [00:52:59]:
This is a little hudder with African black wood handle. The 5160 blade and 416 stainless guard.

Bob DeMarco [00:53:11]:
It's just pretty shiny.

Bob DeMarco [00:53:13]:
Yeah.

Jeff Schafer [00:53:15]:
So I got, right here on the, on the end, there's a neat little bird's beak type feature there. It's not too thick.

Bob DeMarco [00:53:26]:
So how does the blade stay in the hand? Oh, keep holding that up for a sec. Is there a mechanical connection there or is that epoxy? How does that fit in?

Jeff Schafer [00:53:36]:
Right now it's just epoxy. There's going to be a sterling silver pin.

Bob DeMarco [00:53:40]:
Oh, nice. Yeah, I have it.

Jeff Schafer [00:53:43]:
I still, I don't have my name on it either.

Bob DeMarco [00:53:45]:
And it's not sharp, so it's, it's on its way.

Jeff Schafer [00:53:48]:
It's. Yeah.

Bob DeMarco [00:53:50]:
That's beautiful. Thank you.

Jeff Schafer [00:53:52]:
I also brought one of these little paring knives I make. I made a bunch of these for people. Little paring knife with some.

Bob DeMarco [00:54:02]:
That antique micarta.

Jeff Schafer [00:54:04]:
Yes. Paper micarta.

Bob DeMarco [00:54:07]:
That's beautiful.

Bob DeMarco [00:54:08]:
This looks, yeah, it's a paring knife, but it also looks like it could be an, an everyday. Sort of looks like it has all sorts of uses.

Jeff Schafer [00:54:16]:
Yeah, I've made some sheaths for some. Yeah, I got a little knife that I made for my buddy. He was, he, he was going jogging and needed a little thing to carry while he was jogging. So I just made this out of Scrap for him gets a little sheath.

Bob DeMarco [00:54:33]:
Oh, that's nice.

Bob DeMarco [00:54:35]:
That's nice and thin too.

Jeff Schafer [00:54:36]:
You know that very. It doesn't, it doesn't get in the way when you're, when you're running.

Bob DeMarco [00:54:42]:
So I, this is a huge part of the market. I think this is where a lot of people who are, you know, traditionally into folders and, and just everyday carry folders and such, big trend over the past five years that keeps growing are these everyday carry fixed blades. I'm huge into them. But is this something that you're considering moving into?

Jeff Schafer [00:55:07]:
Right, yeah. I, I, I've been carrying a, what I call a front pocket knife, but I did not, did not bring it out here, but just a little front pocket knife that has kind of a, an oval handle with a deep finger spot where you can just fits perfectly in the hand, but it's only like 6 inches long and then it just.

Bob DeMarco [00:55:36]:
Fits right in the, in the pocket. I, I love that. I'm, I'm a huge fan of everyday carry fixed blade knives. I love neck knives, though. I don't tend to carry them as much as I used to.

Bob DeMarco [00:55:48]:
Right.

Jeff Schafer [00:55:48]:
Yeah.

Bob DeMarco [00:55:49]:
But I, that, that comes and goes. I still collect them. So maybe I just have to get my blue belt.

Jeff Schafer [00:55:56]:
Okay.

Bob DeMarco [00:55:57]:
Get my, There you go. My green belt or whatever comes after blue. All right, so before I let you go, please, let's see that big Bowie again.

Jeff Schafer [00:56:05]:
You're Tinker. Your Tinker Bowie.

Bob DeMarco [00:56:08]:
Your Louis l'.

Jeff Schafer [00:56:08]:
Amour.

Bob DeMarco [00:56:10]:
That's beautiful.

Bob DeMarco [00:56:12]:
So you do your own leather too, huh?

Jeff Schafer [00:56:15]:
Yes.

Bob DeMarco [00:56:15]:
Yeah, that.

Bob DeMarco [00:56:17]:
Okay. So this is something I want in my collection. Is a, is a, is a, a Bowie with a, a crown stag handle like that.

Bob DeMarco [00:56:25]:
That is just beautiful.

Jeff Schafer [00:56:27]:
This, these fit in the hand so well. If you get the right one. Yeah, this is all forged. It's got the kind of the brute Deforge look to it. You know, the Ricasso's forged finish and the spine is forged finish. And there's a little bit right here along the edges you can maybe see.

Bob DeMarco [00:56:48]:
Yeah, yeah, we can see that.

Jeff Schafer [00:56:52]:
And the guard is all forged finish. No grinding on that.

Bob DeMarco [00:56:58]:
So let people know how they can keep up with you. See what you're making. Reach out to you commission work, let everyone know.

Jeff Schafer [00:57:08]:
Okay. I'm Schaefer Jeff on Instagram. I also have Shaffer knives also on Facebook. Shaffer knives on Facebook. And you know, I got my own personal page as well. And my website is www.schaeffer knives.com. not much on there except T shirts right now. And let's See that, that's most, most of it.

Bob DeMarco [00:57:34]:
I have.

Jeff Schafer [00:57:34]:
I also have a YouTube channel, but it's, it's got a few videos of croissant and stuff on there.

Bob DeMarco [00:57:41]:
I'll have to check that out. That's one thing I did not find.

Bob DeMarco [00:57:44]:
In, in, in, in the, in my research.

Bob DeMarco [00:57:47]:
So I'll definitely have to check that out. It was really nice talking with you, Jeff. I, I cannot wait to get one of your knives in hand. And I, I know like the, the one that Rolando had is, is very appealing to me, but the Louis Lamour even more so. So I love what you do and it's been real nice talking with you.

Jeff Schafer [00:58:09]:
Thank you. It's been very nice talking to you. Been listening to you for a long time. Oh, cool. But I hadn't been a patreon just a few months and I was like amazed at how much content you put out. Wow, man, you, you really get with it. I love it all. I love, especially your Maker Mondays.

Jeff Schafer [00:58:25]:
I love those guys like Don Hansen here lately. And let's see, who else did you.

Bob DeMarco [00:58:31]:
Have that I like?

Jeff Schafer [00:58:33]:
Anyway, it doesn't matter.

Bob DeMarco [00:58:34]:
Yeah, Tony Bose. We've had a bunch of guys. This is, this is the, the handiwork of Jim, our producer here.

Jeff Schafer [00:58:41]:
Oh yeah, yeah.

Bob DeMarco [00:58:42]:
He does an awesome job.

Jeff Schafer [00:58:43]:
He does. Yeah. Right.

Bob DeMarco [00:58:46]:
Well, thank you so much, Jeff. The pleasure has been mine, sir.

Jeff Schafer [00:58:49]:
Thank you. I appreciate you.

Announcer [00:58:52]:
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Bob DeMarco [00:59:23]:
There he goes. Ladies and gentlemen, Jeff Schafer of Schafer Knives. Go check him out and all the places he was discussing. Definitely Instagram. You'll see a lot of cool pictures and check out Rolando's video. He takes a deep dive, about a half hour deep dive into that big beautiful Bowie chopper. Also all right for Jim working his magic behind the switcher, I'm Bob DeMarco saying until next time, don't take dull for an answer.

Announcer [00:59:47]:
Thanks for listening to the Knife Junkie podcast. If you enjoyed the show, please rate and review@reviewthepodcast.com for show notes for today's episode, additional resources and to listen to past episodes, Visit our website thenifejunkie.com you can also watch our latest videos on YouTube@thenifejunkie.com YouTube it.