Announcer 0:03
Welcome to the Knife Junkie podcast your weekly dose of knife news and information about knives and knife collecting. Here's your hosts Jim Person and Bob The Knife Junkie DeMarco.

Jim Person 0:17
Hello fellow Knife Junkie and welcome to episode number 54 of the Knife Junkie podcast. I'm Jim the knife newbie Person. And I'm Bob DeMarco Welcome to the podcast, the Knife Junkie podcast and The Knife junkie.com It's the place for knife newbies and Knife Junkie is to learn about knives and knife collecting and hear from knife designers, makers, manufacturers reviewers and anyone who loves knives and Bob we've got a pair of brothers on the show today our interview show today that are are doing that they love knives and kind of doing it. I was gonna say on the side which sounds like it's a hobby but they have full time careers and a full time knife making business if you will, and that's

Bob DeMarco 0:57
right today we're talking to Terrell and Seth Todd of Todd knife and tools. You know Terrell SZL Rick 42 famed knife reviewer on YouTube he also had Apex news with an edge which was a nice new show on YouTube and he had a knife podcast for a while. Terrell is just well let's just say he's neck deep in knives and he really knows his stuff. And he and his brother Seth have been designing on CAD and also creating in the shop with their very own hands. prototypes for some really incredible flippers that have now been turned into knives produced by we and best tech. They have the Roxy the Roxy for and the malware out. Those are made by best tech and we respectively. And these guys are we're knife fans who just really turned their criticism into creativity. You know what I mean? They they took things that they liked and took things that they didn't like about knives, and just started making their own.

Jim Person 1:58
turn them into things that Good like

Bob DeMarco 2:00
That's right. That's right. And someone from the southern renaissance of Maven Michelangelo, I can't remember who said this but said criticize through creating. In other words don't just sit around and bitch

Jim Person 2:12
about, oh, this knife should be better here they should have a choice. Make your own. Do something about it. Yeah, and they did. They did.

We'll get to that interview in just a sec but I want to remind you that if you've got a small business, whatever it is knife making or anything else, you can take managing that small business and those finances to the next level focus on growing your biz. While QuickBooks Online handles everything else. Use this special link to get 50% off your subscription. Just go to The Knife Junkie. com slash Quick Books, you'll get 50% off either QuickBooks Online or QuickBooks self employed for the first six months. Get started with QuickBooks self employed or quickbooks online today again 50% off if you use our special link The Knife Junkie comm slash QuickBooks You know you're a Knife Junkie If you answer to the nickname blade.

Bob DeMarco 3:04
Alright, I'm here with Terrell and Seth Todd of Todd knife and tool. You know Terrell as well. Rick 42 on YouTube, he reviews knives and has a new show about knives and his brother Seth. He is also a knife guy. They are partners in Todd knife and tool guys. Welcome to the show. Thanks. Thanks for

Unknown Speaker 3:21
we're glad to be here.

Bob DeMarco 3:23
Yep, it's my pleasure to have you I've been watching while I've been watching you Terrell for quite a while on YouTube, but just really paying attention to the Todd knife and tool knives that have been coming out the first one that that really hit my frontal lobe was the malware and then I just saw your video on the Roxy which is right up my alley, explained to me guys explain to me how you went from knife enthusiasts to knife makers and owners of a knife company.

Teryl Todd 3:52
Well, Seth is probably better to start with that story because well, go ahead, sir.

Seth Todd 3:58
Yeah, I mean, I think Terrell Was into the YouTube videos and all that stuff kind of bar was and I have always carried a knife but had never really gone beyond like spider code delicate spider Cohen dura kind of all of that was was what I just carried all my life and in the military, and but I remember whenever we were small kids, our daddy said, you know make build, fabricate all kinds of stuff in the shop behind the house. We were down at the family junkyard that might sound strange for some people, but there was a family junkyard in in Sparta, Missouri. And we were there one day and we were looking through a bunch of parts. My dad found some leaf springs, and he said, you know, you can make a knife out of these. And of course, I was like, well, let's do that right right now. And turned out, never did and a dad passed away kind of young and Never happened. I was sitting home just letting YouTube play while I was working one night. And this guy you guys probably know him. Michael gaffe co was on YouTube doing crazy making a knife in his in his garage with the dirt and sanding and grinding dust everywhere. And I was like, I'm gonna I'm gonna do that on a make a knife. So I went to work the next day. And I have a development team that works with Nana, software development, and I was like, Yeah, I think I'm going to make a knife and and I pulled up there like what kind of knife and I was like, I don't know, pulled up custom knives on Google in the Praetorian. Greg Medford Praetorian came out. I was like, I don't know something like that. And they pretty much laughed at me. And then you know, I kind of told Terrell, I was like, I'm going to try and do this. He was like, okay, and I don't know. It was probably about a year later and probably about $40,000 for I think I came up with the first knife one of those knives you gave away right?

Unknown Speaker 6:05
Yeah, yeah, we did

Seth Todd 6:06
that looked a lot like Praetorian in a way that was a fixed blade and then that wasn't the goal the goal was to make a folding I want to make something I can carry myself and then I think that Chris around that December me and my girlfriend at the time drove up to actual Springfield Missouri where Charles at and picked up a mill like a manual mini mill from what's the place up there to prison prism, grisly, drove it back in my truck, and then and then kind of went from there.

Bob DeMarco 6:44
Wow, you did the first thing you got was a mill.

Seth Todd 6:46
Well, no, no, no. The first thing I got. And this is for anybody who's trying to get into this. And it's changed I think a little bit in the last four or five years but whenever I started trying to get into it, makers, really Like the most secretive people in the world, like they don't want to tell you anything about how I mean not like I said it's changed some but at the time, they won't tell you anything about how they make knives or anything like that. And I bought all the wrong stuff. I mean, I started with angle grinder and like the worst belt grinder you've ever seen. And then I bought this thing from what's the knife knife work or knife supply store here that's in Houston, which they do some great stuff but they have this beginner's knife. Grinding grinder horrible thing could probably kill you.

Unknown Speaker 7:36
matter of seconds. Yeah, it's under my workbench right now.

Unknown Speaker 7:40
Yeah, not done. I would suggest to anybody I tried that that was a horrible deal. And I got a grinder. That was the first thing from Northridge tool. Great guys over at Northridge. They've done us really good and they have really great product. That was the first thing. I think once I made a few of those fixed blade knives then we move on. Then Then I went and got just basically said not gonna be able to do this

Unknown Speaker 8:04
we share a lot of this stuff like the Northridge grinders that's what we both got it now we do differ on kills. I haven't even heat killed he has a paragon and I think we're both pretty much stuck on our kills and wouldn't switch. If we were in a shop together, we would still have two different kills. Well do they have? Do they have different properties? Or are they just do the same thing? You just like how they interface better?

Seth Todd 8:28
I like the interface on mine. He likes the interface on his Yeah, they're probably both fine. I the quality. The aesthetic of the Paragon is better.

Teryl Todd 8:38
Yeah, he is right about that. Mine's all chrome and shiny and looks like a kitchen appliance and his is all looks like a medieval torture chamber nice or something.

Unknown Speaker 8:49
Yeah, something to get mine. I was at a chance

Unknown Speaker 8:53
chance shall.

Seth Todd 8:55
We drove me my girlfriend drove up the Janse from here, one on one week. And they had just gotten back from blade show the week before that point, I still didn't even really know what blade show was. And they had a demo model of a one that was coming out. And I asked if they would sell it to me. And they said, Yes, sure when I bought it.

Bob DeMarco 9:16
So do you guys do all of your own? Let's flash forward to now? Because look, just looking at the quality of what you've called prototypes online. Do you make all of those in your own shop? They look pretty sophisticated. Yes.

Seth Todd 9:31
Yeah, I started out. I'm like I started trying to make some hits. You go way back down on the Instagram page, you'll find some that probably aren't so sophisticated. I mean, Instagram lighting, might make them look okay, but they weren't. They weren't the most fantastic. Started out trying to make them without CAD. Got a couple that were reasonable that worked, but it wasn't going to happen and then had the lawn care, spent some time learning cat and then the The thing that is, and I won't say this is always the case, but I think is interesting about the way we do it. There are a lot of designers out there that they just design, they draw a whole bunch of drawings, they might pass drawings to a production company, or they do drawings and they work with somebody with CAD to get a CAD drawing, we generally will design the knife, mate and get it toward one it and CAD make the knife actually produce a handmade version, which for what it's worth, if I do that usually takes me anywhere from about 40 to 60 hours of labor. And it's a lot of that is because you're just making these one off right there. No jigs, there's no that anything, it's the first time every time and then we'll take that production knife to the production company and will actually let them put it in hand after we've taken it out and used it and there might be like, some of the knives I think I made three or four different versions of the prototypes by hand before they actually like the Roxy I think had three prototype versions before it actually went to put it on. company and we said hey, this is this is the one that's changed a little bit. With the

Unknown Speaker 11:07
advent, you're missing one of the major things we do now is both of us while both of us have FDM 3d printers, and that works in to checking size or goes all that and and then for final knives to take to these production companies, I've now got a DLP printer, Bruce SL one that we will use because we can take the plastic knife made out of the DLP printer that is spot on, but what the real knife would be, and we can hand it to the city especially if we're having production done in Asia. We can hand it to them and then they can actually take that one home because it's not enough, right. So they can see what it really is supposed to look like while they're working on their End of the chaos and all that,

Bob DeMarco 12:02
let me back up for a second you talk about using CAD and then you talk about hand making it to me as a as a non knife maker. And certainly as a non CAD guy, I always was under the impression that you, you design it in CAD, you create a file in CAD, and then you stuff that thing in the middle and it produces the night for you boom, now.

Seth Todd 12:24
Now, the middle of the mill that I have doesn't even have what's called a DRO, which is a digital readout. So it's 100% manual, meaning that there's a bunch of little tick marks all over that thing and you've got accounts and we're trying to make some things extremely difficult. So, the first knives and it as Terrell pointed out, things are a little bit different. Now I've got a laser also that's kind of incorporated into this but first knives on what we do is you bring them into CAD, you get the models, you turn the models into drawings, and then you print those out on the card stock and then You take and you cut those out with either a razor knife or scissors. And then you take Super 77 and you'll glue those down to a piece of titanium and piece

Unknown Speaker 13:12
of steel. Oh, hang on here. Super 77 is just an adhesive.

Unknown Speaker 13:17
Yeah, and then yeah, and then

Unknown Speaker 13:22
go out and then what I generally would do is cut cut all the pieces down to reasonable size close to close to what they're going to be bait and then glue those on there. And then you go through with a manual mill and you actually drill and countable and counter sync all of the holes for the handle scales and the blade, etc. And then you go to a grinder from there, like normally you get advance off first and then you go to a grinder and shape everything by

Bob DeMarco 13:55
exactly up to the contours of the paper. And and that's where you're getting your decision. That's where the payoff is from using CAD. Right,

Seth Todd 14:02
right. If you don't do the CAD, like the big problem with that is, you won't know whether that knife is actually going to lock or not. If you just do it on paper, I mean, you can get lucky or you can play with cardboard and pieces of wood and stuff. But in CAD I can I can define whether a knife is going to lock or not whether the flipping action is going to work how well the booking action is going to work, before I ever print it to a piece of paper.

Bob DeMarco 14:26
So, Terrell describe to me the design process. You've got two talents here, and your brothers, how does that work?

Teryl Todd 14:35
One of us will start with the concept and idea for the shape or whatever. And as we've talked about a little bit before you kind of know where we're coming from from watching the videos. We're always looking for a usable shape, a shape that is going to be mostly comfortable in the hand and that's not 100% for us being usable, is the first thing and then make it comfortable to us. And and once we got a base shape set down, then we go back and forth inside Can you can share it with us fusion 360. So you can share the CAD files, their cloud storage type deal where I can mess with the CAD file and Seth can mess with CAD file and back and forth. And from there, we refine the knife down. Now currently Sif does do the final like he was talking about on lockup making sure that's all going to work out right. And a couple of the other really tactical things that I haven't caught up on yet. So it's a collaboration between the two of us on getting to a final design, but the designs basically come out of is it going to be useful? You know, there are other designers out there that make things that are really cool to look at and four seven I there's there's very little of that if it's not going to be useful then it's there's no point in making it.

Seth Todd 16:07
Now I will say the caveat to that probably in this turned out like a happy coincidence was the malware. Yeah I had I had designed not that we've had that many of these made but I designed a ton of knives that were like specifically needs to work this way it needs to fit in the hand this way. And and I sat down one night and did the malware and I was like, I just want something looks cool and stabbing. And believe it or not, though it turned out to be one of the most useful like day to day carry especially for a gentleman's carry and I turned out to be really but that honestly wasn't the intention whenever that was done.

Bob DeMarco 16:44
You kind of allude to Well, you didn't allude you said straight out at function comes first. And and I believe that but you have such a strong design language, the Todd knife and tools I feel like I've seen three of them now the malware the Roxy and then one that preceded them. Both have been They had a shorter blade, but they all look like brothers or cousins. You know, they're all the same family.

Unknown Speaker 17:06
Yeah, the original was the Roxy and the one you just saw last couple days was the Roxy for. Okay. All right. And yeah, that that's a very interesting thing whenever we were doing this and getting started with everything we talked about, we need to have a design language that says this is a thought knife and tool knife. And we're working off of manual Mills. So making some kind of funny curves or certain flourishes and that sort of stuff was kind of out. Because with a manual mill, you can do all that stuff, but it takes a lot of time. And straight lines are relatively easy. They're not easy to line up, you know, from side to side, but there's still a lot easier and a bunch of crazy flourishes or something. So say I don't remember what model it was, was it may have been the Master Chief that you did it to first.

Unknown Speaker 18:06
But yeah, trying to remember, I think it was either the, it might have been the second prototype of the Roxy.

Unknown Speaker 18:13
But Seth was we had talked about it. And Seth was out in the shop messing with one of the prototypes. And he ran down and did these lines that you now know is the top knife and tool design language. And we looked at and we're like, hey, that's pretty freakin cool. And yeah, and then since then, on any knife that's Angular. We try to stay with that. And it's for the customer, as well as us, but it's for the customer so they know what they're getting. No matter who's whether it says best tech or we or whoever on it. They look at it and they know they're getting a Todd knife and tool knife even though it's a completely different design than whatever the other companies have got

Bob DeMarco 18:59
all the Straight lines and channels. I feel like there are channels, obviously there are fillers in the bride's. And and there are lines and kind of terrorist areas and the handles they all look like they aid to grip they definitely have a strong aesthetic identity you know, but they also look like they're meaningful not just like you were trying to put in Yeah, lines to make it look

Unknown Speaker 19:24
well I would say there's a lot of stuff and Yeah, I agree with you. I mean, they it wasn't just a let me just go see what I can get in here. I think they they had an intention to be there. And like influencers that probably Tashi might get upset if I say this because me and him actually disagree on a bunch of design stuff, but I like the way Tashi makes every kind of line fit together whenever the knife is closed or the knife is open. I try to stick to a similar point of you unless it were will disagree is for him. It's probably like hey, it really doesn't matter whether impact The function in that life, it's got to be that way. Whereas all say, Hey, now, the nice gotta have a better function if that means one of these lines is perfect, and then that's got to change but there's a lot of additional stuff outside of just that those handles scale cuts. You'll notice there's always on the flipper knives, there's always a landing pad for your finger behind the nice so if you want to flip all day long and flip all day long, there's always a dual cut out on both sides of the inside of the handle scales for ambidextrous operation of the knife. Both both Terrell and I are both ambidextrous. So that's there to make sure that you can open it easy you don't get that like I gotta cram my thumb down here between these these. Yeah.

Unknown Speaker 20:42
And that's actually something that came up as we were designing knives is the frustration. And at the time, we both generally carried a lock back spider CO and the reason for that was more about the fact that that Knife is 100% ambidextrous, then it was style or preference or anything like that because for both of us the frustration of a knife that can't be manipulated well with the left hand is is huge. And so as we were designing you even the beginning and now that was a one of the major sticky points was to make sure Another point that we do is if you look across one of our knives from lock side to show side, the show side is not raised in the lock side is not lowered at the lock interface. Yes, and that's for ambidextrous and that's also so that you don't disengage the knife accidentally, like was a ZT had a big kerfuffle about one of their knives that people were claiming was bad design because it opened on them. It wasn't you're not supposed to torque things with your knife, right? But we thought we just eliminate that by not having that feature in there.

Bob DeMarco 22:04
And putting those cuts you mentioned that in in the recent video you put out on the Roxy for you actually show that and not only does it seem to be functional in terms of making it kind of equal for lefties and righties, but it's also cleaner. It just cleans up the design. It's already an immaculate design but, but that little aspect of not having that little dip or swell there just keeps it keeps the design pure. Yeah,

Unknown Speaker 22:33
it does and we agree but it also lights up the other reviewers out there that just it's hilarious, but

Unknown Speaker 22:40
also fun. There's a lot of attention to detail on that stuff. Like when you unlock the knife and you bring the blade down, it should hit the thumb right after the detect goes off so you can you know, take your thumb out of the way and then close the night. I'm just a lot of knife stuff for guys that use knives and play with the knives and Fold put knives all the time to make sure that it's a knife that's going to be enjoyable when you're doing all that stuff, but then also useful.

Bob DeMarco 23:07
Right? Yeah. Have you? Terrell, you were talking about how you position the flipper tab. Just Well, I don't know how to get as close to the end of the handle as possible. So they were the pivot forward to the pivot. Yes, thank you. And that's how you're that's how you kind of are allowed, so to speak to us such a diminutive flipper tab. That's how the Flipboard tab is able to work being so small is just the placement right? Absolutely.

Unknown Speaker 23:36
The flipper tab on the Roxy series is 13 and a half thousands. That's so small. Yeah.

Unknown Speaker 23:42
If you it's just sheer leverage. If it's Yeah, and I don't I don't even understand there's a specific knife company that we've talked about working with and I've had the conversation with their designer on how many times because they screw this up every night they make. It's just basic geometry and live If it's in front of the pivot, then you're not going to have to put very much forced to break the detail and be able to put the knife out. If it's on top of the pivot, it's still okay. But if it's behind the pivot, then you have almost no leverage on the thing and then you gotta like be whacking it and flipping it out to get it pre loaded

Bob DeMarco 24:16
with energy pushing the other direction, then really,

Unknown Speaker 24:19
yeah, it's like, Yeah, and that's 1300. So if I don't correct that, somebody's going to

Unknown Speaker 24:25
comments

Bob DeMarco 24:26
so what the Warren Cliff you have a love for the Warren cliff. Now I know you talked about being functional and to me a warren cliff is a great blade shape for many, many different things.

Unknown Speaker 24:38
I agree with you, Bob. But we honestly do not make or have not designed a single worn clay. Okay,

Bob DeMarco 24:45
okay, I take it back, because it's a little bit curved up towards the tip, I think. And that's technically not a warren cliff. Is that correct?

Unknown Speaker 24:52
Well, the knife company is always in the knife. resellers always mark them as a warren cliff and yes, they do look like a warren cliff. Because if you don't set any of them down on something to see that curve, you don't see the curve in the edge. But none of our

Unknown Speaker 25:10
go ahead sand rocks these I think the rocks is pretty much a straight edge. Or, or sorry, the Roxy for

Unknown Speaker 25:16
it's not either. It's close, but it's close. Yes, but their modified one

Unknown Speaker 25:21
clip is what you call it kind of like a sax

Bob DeMarco 25:24
that kind of like it's kind of like an old

Unknown Speaker 25:25
young sax

Unknown Speaker 25:26
got a little bit of Greg Medford actually called the Roxy for sax Nice. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I agree. I agree.

Unknown Speaker 25:36
Every time you talk to us as talks to us, it's always a sexy knife, the Saxena.

Bob DeMarco 25:41
So what's that blade shaped to you? Well, I know buoy so far.

Teryl Todd 25:47
Okay. So the reason for that is is the wharncliff is a very usable blade. But if you're doing everyday stuff, you're always any soft material. You're cutting on a flat surface, you're always using the tip to cut with, if it's a straight born cliff, whenever we put that little kick up that little curve at the end of the blade, whenever you do that, now you have that little bit of belly to draw against something and you're not having to poke the end of the knife in there. And it's actually a thing for the customer again, or the purchaser because not everybody can sharpen a knife extremely well. And the points of a warren cliff, if you see the average knife, guys knife, the points of a warren Cliff are always rounded. And that's that's just the way it happens. So you don't have that point, the point if they have to sharpen that all the time, but if you give them a little bit of belly, then they'll, they'll naturally use that little bit of belly, their hand won't be in the awkward position. And it's just a better experience. And then I think we're

Unknown Speaker 26:55
stuck to it. I mean, if you look through the Instagram stuff, we've got There's a few designs of the one cliff and then you got them all where but it's just the ones that have gone production. I think probably my favorite kind of like useful is probably like a leaf shape. Almost a spear point,

Unknown Speaker 27:13
right? And you've got an exploit a show Dan and or root kid and it said op sec, Seth info sec info sec. That's right offsets another one I'm working on that none of those are weren't glyphs. They're all either leaves or drop points.

Bob DeMarco 27:31
Cool. Well, I look forward to seeing how those kind of very organic shapes work into the rest of your kind of design language or whether it's going to be Angular, if it's going to be that juxtaposition of Angular, and organic. Don't tell me now I want to wait and see.

Unknown Speaker 27:47
To your point there Bob. One of the things that's a value out of Terrell doing the channel and all the YouTube stuff and all the podcasts that they do and everything, is we get a lot of feedback around what people do. We're done. Like about knives, almost I think every single life channel mentioned except for one, the CAD files are actually posted on Instagram, if not prototypes of those knives already. And the more people want to jump in and say, Hey, this is what I don't like this way, I'm not saying we're going to change it. But but the better. The better feedback that we get. The whole kind of concept of this out of the beginning was Terrell did this knife channel was to be able to take what the viewers and the followers and everybody thought was going to be a good knife and be able to get that into production and be able to deliver something that was what everybody wants.

Bob DeMarco 28:38
Yeah. Well, that that allow you to be nimble as a company to

Unknown Speaker 28:42
Yeah, you know, we would love to fall on that, that XM 18 or the delicate or whatever, to have that continuous production knife. But we may or may not have found it yet. We don't know. But we're going to continue to iterate on to what the community tells us. Now granted the the base designs and concepts are going to come out of our nutty heads. But the little things like, like not having a sharpening choice, which horribly upsets half the community and the other half of the community just absolutely loves. Now, this half that loves it, we kind of fall on their side, because we literally hate to stick a knife in a box or something and have it get caught. And you know, and there's also tactical reasons for that, that probably shouldn't talk about but

Bob DeMarco 29:37
no, you can talk about that stuff here. Clothing could easily get caught in an oil have a frequently thought

Unknown Speaker 29:43
some of the large toils like I have some an XML team, that they will toil on that if I were in that tactical situation, and I needed to stick that knife into some soft stuff. On the way back out that big old toils going to get caught and it's going to come Me problems. And that's a point in my life where I don't want problems. I want everything to work.

Unknown Speaker 30:07
It's just day to day I go to stick, stick a knife into a, you know, an Amazon package and it gets caught on the oil that just annoys the shit up. It's the one thing that I think everyone almost all the videos people bringing up and some of them complain some of them don't. And that's probably the one thing that will never change. I some of my favorite knives. I won't carry on a daily basis because they have a big sharpening oil. And I get that some people have an issue with being able to sharpen the knives meant to be used and that's not going to be the end all and be all of you, you you screw up the backside there on the sharp end again if for some reason you absolutely need it. You can get a Dremel at Walmart for about 25 bucks. Right?

Unknown Speaker 30:54
Right. Right and and another thing just so that we don't get a bunch of crazy feedback off this. We do. Have a couple of models that are coming out that do have a forward finger oil that's very big and isn't doesn't have a blade stop behind it. However, those knives are specifically designed to be held with your finger in that choice.

Bob DeMarco 31:15
Gotcha like that that is a part of the handle. It's not an option. It's the way it's meant to be gripped.

Unknown Speaker 31:21
Yeah, you know what the viewers and followers and video watchers and stuff they all think that I don't know they think you're supposed to have two options and you don't have to choke up on the night. But really, I do believe every knife we've designed is really designed to be have your hand in that what they call it choked up position.

Unknown Speaker 31:44
But have your finger in that choil.

Bob DeMarco 31:46
Well I noticed on the Roxy for with your finger is up in the oil which is kind of how it seems to be designed. You still have a full four inches of edge right i mean like that edge comes all the way back to below the the front part of the handle.

Unknown Speaker 32:00
I think it actually comes out to like 3.8 but yeah, four inches.

Bob DeMarco 32:04
Okay. Yeah, I mean you're you're close to having an entire length of the blade to cut with with your finger in that soil.

Unknown Speaker 32:12
Yeah. And and I think I don't know that we've designed very many at all that don't have that like this is and I know the viewers can't see this but this is the Roxy three this will probably go into production with we at some point in the next year and a half or so. And this is a non flipping knife. It uses a roller lock opening mechanism but you'll see even on that it's designed to be held in here and that forward choice

Bob DeMarco 32:36
describe what it's been like you mentioned to me what is it been like working with we and and the other, you know, foreign manufacturers that you've worked with and what do you think they've done for the industry in general?

Unknown Speaker 32:48
Oh boy, working with we can be a joy and a frustration. They make excellent, excellent knives. And but the problem comes MZN and the initial our knives are different from everyone else's one our CAD files not on the first one or two but our CAD files anymore are pretty much done. They are you could put them in KM, if you knew how to mess with cam and you could go and produce the knife. And that one of the problems that we do have is their CAD people because they we use fusion 360 and then they transfer it over to solid works at different CAD package for their machines. And also they have to get it translated to Chinese Of course, with solid works and the problems come in at that point. With we they can sometimes be frustrating, but they usually get we've got a lady over there. We can call her out doors. She gets things smooth out generally fairly quickly.

Unknown Speaker 33:55
Yeah, I mean they they do a good job. I mean they do an amazing job on the knives sodas, yes, tech, um, it's a little bit of a different field. But other than the fact that they're so popular and they have such a backlog that if if we'd like, we've got two nights with them supposed to be going to production now. Give you an example. I think the Roxy was right at two, two and a quarter years before it hit production something Yeah, two years, something like that. Yeah, so other than the timeline, I mean, they do a really good job to Terrell's point. It can be frustrating to have the conversation go back and forth and try and explain one tiny little change that needs to happen. Yeah. But they're very much about whatever we feel like the design should be they want to they want to bring that design the life into production. Very seldom has there ever ever been anything with week where they've been like, we think we should change this? Not the route against if they got a good idea. Let's change it. But yeah, what you get is what the CAD file show.

Unknown Speaker 34:57
Yeah, it's almost frustrating with we That they are so true to the CAD file a lot of times we would like this to be a collaboration with them. And if they do see something you like a, like a third check on the knife design. Right. Right. But we they are so good that they are so true to the CAD file that it's it's almost scary. Because you and makes us a little bit nervous about making sure those CAD files are perfect. Yeah, yeah, well, we send them off. Whenever we work with best tech, it's very much the same thing. They are a little bit more in the Hey, we think maybe we should do it this way. However, if if we've said no, we're not going we don't want to do it that way. They'll back up and they'll okay. You're the designers. That's cool.

Bob DeMarco 35:49
How do you choose who to take what design to how do you decide which company gets which knife? How does that work?

Unknown Speaker 35:56
I don't think it's necessarily which I mean to some degree We do that there's definitely sometimes where we're like we want this one made by this company or we want this one made by that company for this that or the other reason but for the most part, we want the we make the CAD design we make prototypes, we put them out there on Instagram, people see him they're like, I want that knife. When can I buy it? We take him we show them we you know, whoever wants to produce them as long as we feel like they can do a good job and they can be fair to the customer then that's that's where it goes. It's never who you think like, like whenever we should we are best tech the mall or whenever we showed we the mall where it was just like, yeah. And then whenever we showed best tech, we didn't even show them the mall where we showed them much knives. They pulled that one out. And they're like, we want to make this right now.

Unknown Speaker 36:45
And we also have fostered some very close relationships with the folks over at best tech and the folks that we and some other companies for that matter, but the closest ones with the guys at best tech and the guys that We know them more than just on a business level yet, and there'll be more in the future I think we're definitely having conversations with a couple of us manufacturers

Unknown Speaker 37:13
to potentially do something there obviously cost and price is a is a concern for people so we want to make sure that we have a design that people are really don't want, right. And then others within the the Asian market as well. And even I think what was the one I they will Russia obviously but

Unknown Speaker 37:32
then another thing that will be is on the table but isn't to fruition yet is we whenever we have everything in order, we will be doing some self branded knives. Currently, we just don't have time but that is on the table. And we're trying to figure out when we're going to have the time because whenever we do that, we want to have one of us free for customer service and to be Be able to take care of the customer I, in my dealing with the industry which I deal fairly deeply with the industry and some other points. I see so many of these guys that try to do self branded stuff and then can't support it and we don't want to be there we want to be there for the customers. Right?

Bob DeMarco 38:24
Well in a world without we invest tech and and those kind of OEM overseas that kind of make things a little bit easier or more affordable. What would Todd knife and tool look like? What? How would you be producing your work? Go ahead.

Unknown Speaker 38:43
I mean, I think originally the intent was to make custom knives and just have the one off, but for the way that we make them in the way that I make them in the fact that I don't make the same one over and over again, Terrell doesn't make same one over and over again. The price would just be faster. Article. And I think some of the stuff that we're working with some of the US manufacturers on is, is probably something that we would have gotten to eventually, it's just, it's a lot more risk associated with that. And I think it's good that those, you know, the best texts in the we're out there because we're doing this podcast, you get more people, you get more followers, you get a lot of videos up about how knives are good. And then if you do kind of transition into that, where you got a self branded knife that's maybe producing us or collaboration with the US manufacturer, then you've got a lot more chance of not losing at all. Because if you're going to go that route, generally you're going to have to come out of pocket a significant amount of money,

Unknown Speaker 39:43
right. And one reason we didn't go the full custom route and I still toy with doing especially custom fixed blades, I've got some connections to do some really crazy stuff there. But the problem comes in is every time I look at that, and I look at pricing on that. And I'm looking at a three or three and a half inch fixed blade and I'm going to have to charge 500 or $600 for it. And I know there's a market out there for that. But we really want to have our knives available for most people. Yeah,

Unknown Speaker 40:22
when I retire whenever chill retires, there's probably a definitely a custom market. You know, plan, lots of custom knives made. But at this point, it wouldn't even be like, here's open books in here knives it would be like I spent the last three months making this knife. It takes me with when I can do it, it probably takes me a month to make a prototype if I'm doing pretty good. So it's like, the cost is just going to be ridiculous. And then it would just be like, Hey, you know, kind of like crow like Derek and row like what is it like six or seven knives a year or something like

Unknown Speaker 40:55
that? Yeah, and, and he's right I'm you know, I work For the government, and I'm drawing in our retirement here pretty quick. And at that point, there will probably be various custom fixed blades and maybe some custom folders. But they'll be very sporadic. There won't be books it's going to be when it's done. It's done type of deal. Right.

Bob DeMarco 41:19
Right. It kind of by what you've made, and that's that,

Unknown Speaker 41:22
right. Yeah.

Bob DeMarco 41:24
So what how is the industry changed since you've been involved? And not even necessarily since Todd knife and tool has been involved, but since you've been kind of, well, a part of the terrible you a part of the knife community on YouTube and, and Seth as a knife lover, how have you seen this industry, change, grow, evolve, evolve? What do you see?

Teryl Todd 41:47
Okay, well, I'll take that one first. November 19th 2015. Whenever I put up the first YouTube video, there were a handful of major companies and they hadn't names like Kershaw and CRKT. And zero tolerance and met for diving tool and, and so on. Shortly after that the next the 2000s yes was 2016 the next summer we came about and we knife company changed the entire industry quickly. And I say it was him because it was they came out, they come out in Atlanta and said, we're going to have 20 knives this year. They didn't even have a distribution plan at the point at that point. But they did a good job with their design. And they did make 20 different models. And that caused a lot of uproar in the industry. The other Asian manufacturers came on, the Italian manufacturers came on stronger, the American manufacturers, even the small guys, they change the way that they were manufacturing. Your XM series from hinder and the various other ones from Rick have changed rapidly in the past four years. It's been well everything has just rapidly gotten better because of we best tech react and then producing really high quality knives at I don't want to say a reasonable price but a better price than what the US companies were doing and the Italian companies were doing at the time. And it's is brought the Italian companies I don't know that their quality is really come up to par, but their prices have come down. The US companies have held prices, but the quality and the manufacturing processes that the US companies are using have went way up with the exception of metric knife and tool who was doing that anyhow. Right, Greg? I don't know if you know Greg, but his manufacturing ideas are you just need to interview him sometime and talk

Bob DeMarco 44:16
about it. He's been on the podcast. He's got an amazing process I love especially his his whole pivot process and how he described it to me.

Seth Todd 44:26
Yeah, we've had that discussion.

Bob DeMarco 44:28
Yeah, yeah. I've had a lot of discussion with Greg about pivots. It's It's amazing. You know, once you really get into a thing, like knives or or anything else, it's amazing how a you can sit down and talk for an hour about them and be how passionate people get about them. What kind of what kind of reactions have you gotten to your designs from nice people since you've been ramping up your output?

Seth Todd 44:54
Yeah, I mean, I Terrell probably gets a lot more direct. I would say a little Lot of people are probably like 70% of the people follow tonight until don't even know that I am part of it. Terrell Rollins a lot more than I do. But I mean, I would say it's been pretty amazing that I watch every single YouTube video, I go through almost every single post from a repo standpoint, and we don't have a lot a huge following like a lot of people do at this point. But I can only think of like, maybe two or three negative reviews. And those weren't necessarily what I would call negative reviews. They were just like, I don't this is not for me knife kind of situation. And in people generally seem to really like them. And appreciate the fact that we put a lot of time and effort into the things that if you're a nice guy, you notice that a nice guy did this, right. did this for you. Yeah. In terms of all those things on the night so I mean, I I think one of the most interesting things about this for me, is you know, going to blood show meeting These people, the people that were willing to help me through the process of learning how to make a knife I know I talked about a lot of guys who won't, you know, don't want to share anything. But there were a lot of people that did. I mean, there were, whenever I was learning CAD, there were some people that helped me a lot with CAD. There were there are some other designers out there that helped me out with a lot of questions I had. And then there are just some really great people. And that in the integrity of people, and just in general, the community is it's one of like, well, people argue and get upset about toils and stuff like that. I would say, if you went up to the Twitter verse or the, you know, Instagram verse and you said, if you could measure the positivity of a community or a segment of people, I'd have to think that the night community is probably one of the most positive communities there is social anyway.

Teryl Todd 46:53
I agree that there have been aggressive negative comments. From some individuals especially on YouTube, but YouTube provides this really nice button that I'm sure you know about Bob the Yeah, the year gone but you can type all you want button, right? But that's only been a very, very less than 1% whenever I do the videos on our own knives and I explain like you saw on the Roxy for video, what I get most of the time is people that are positive about it, even if they don't agree with it. They're just happy that I explained what our thought process was and that thought went into it.

Seth Todd 47:37
Right I will say the one bad thing and I know this is going to get this will probably get a lot of people upset. I get a ton of people to you know posting because I run the tonight until Instagram about people and companies who have ripped off our designs. And I'm always very like it's cool. Don't worry about it like don't get like they get all protective of the Design and if any other. And you see it all over the place with other people who are passionate about other designers and certain things like that. And the reality of it is that if you're trying to design a knife that works well fits good in the hands, and, you know, etc. There's only so much you can do it. To some degree, it's going to look like another knife that's out there, and I'm not going to get pissed off about it. Whenever someone makes a knife that looks like a Roxy or makes a knife that looks like a malware. And I don't expect you know, others, you know, hopefully to get all bent out of shape. If we make something that is what I would hope to be maybe something like something else, but better or more not necessarily better but suited to this specific thing that I wanted it to be instead of maybe what it was.

Teryl Todd 48:48
There's a story short story about that one Dylan Mallory Mallory designs. He's got an arpeggio, which is a super cool little knife. Well actually it's a big eighth. I got it in several sides. is over an artist and cutlery. I got this text message from some fan that and I've got one phone that the phone numbers out there so I get these things. And he was so upset about Dylan's design. And I'm, and I spent a lot of time trying to explain to this guy. Whenever Dylan was developing this knife, there's a very good chance that some of that design came from things that I talked about with Dylan. Because we talked a lot about the design as he was going through it. And it makes me feel good to see the knife because I know that I had a very, very small part in helping Dylan get there and get that knife produced. And, you know, so yeah, maybe there's some taught knife and tool influence in it. But hey, it's his design.

Unknown Speaker 49:53
Yeah, it's, it's both ways. I've gotten stuff where people just try to just rip and tear and poke Copy people all over Instagram about some cab design that I posted up about how it's a copy. And it's a copy something I've never seen in my life. Right, right. Like,

Bob DeMarco 50:09
it's like settle down. And you know what this is also been an issue in art from time immemorial, you know, especially now that we have such a such a wealth of information that our fingertips literally on our phones and our computers, and you see a million if you're scrolling on Instagram for five minutes, in one day, you see a million knives. That is how people create new things. They're influenced by older things. And there might be elements that you can point to Oh, that's a that's a lesbian shaped opening hole. They ripped that off directly from from Mick Strider, you know, he's the only one who's allowed to do that, to me. You know, we live in a world we live in a complex world ever more complex world and you're seeing more and more and more and more things. You can't help but borrow from here from there or be influenced from here from there to create your thing. I mean, it's one thing to get a knockoff, you know, to have a company, knock off your design. But it's another thing to influence. I mean, that is that should be a little bit flattering.

Unknown Speaker 51:12
Yeah, I mean, one of the reasons whenever we got started, I think one of the things that Carol and I talked a lot about before I actually said I'm going to make a folder was we have these knives, what's your favorite knife, so this is my favorite knife. But XYZ is I bow this my favorite knife, but x, y, z. And it's like, it just did this or if it just had that or if it didn't have this part right here it would be perfect know it's not perfect for everybody. Probably the one that's out there might be perfect for most people. But for us, we you know a lot of that is influential around there might be two or three knives that were like I love these things about all these knives and I want to turn that into you know, super knife. And in that way it might resemble something that's already out there but it's going to be different in a in a specific function or a specific Part of peace.

Unknown Speaker 52:01
If somebody tries to do a direct rip off, of course, we're going to be upset. However, the The only real part of our design that the we're, I don't know, I can't think of the right word here, but possessive of his the external three holes down around the pivot area and the lines on the outside of the knife. If we had someone that was continually vaping that we would be a little bit upset.

Bob DeMarco 52:31
That's a signature,

Unknown Speaker 52:32
right. But besides that, I mean, it goes both ways. We got to be able to improve upon what's out there, bring our own thing to it. And, and if you look at a lot of the popular designs that are out there, a lot of them are classic shapes. And that's because that's the shape that fits in the hand well

Bob DeMarco 52:58
and that's the shape that comes Well, I mean, we've had several hundred thousand years to kind of get to this point, right?

Unknown Speaker 53:05
Yeah. Talk about your hinders your riders, and all those classic designs. If you look at the shape of them, the actual shape of where your hand is on those two knives are very similar. Mick just doesn't cut the end of his off. Yeah, he leaves it Angular. Yeah. So,

Unknown Speaker 53:25
but other than that, I mean, I think everything in general has been positive. I don't think not really gotten or seen any any negative feedback, which is is good. I know. I won't say who he is. But I have a close friend who is a designer who makes some extremely high end knives that sell for seven to $10,000. And he just, he gets such anxiety over the bat. And this is a guy who has I think he's got what terrible like seven 800,000 followers or something. Oh yeah, it's crazy. And he just gets Crazy anxiety over whenever people rip them on YouTube and on social media. So I mean, you just got to kind of take it for what it is.

Unknown Speaker 54:09
Well, yeah, and you know, doing the YouTube thing since 2015. I've got frickin bark, scan, iron, scan, whatever over that. Because I, people are going to say what they're going to say and it's just part of the game.

Bob DeMarco 54:25
Well, I think you guys should, are and should be grateful that you're working in designing and really getting to live out your passion in an industry that is passionate. You know, you're not designing wrenches, you know, that very few people are passionate or care about.

Teryl Todd 54:42
I have designed wrenches.

Bob DeMarco 54:43
Yeah, and no one's heard of them right. Todd life and tonight. So you guys have been in this for a while. You have to have a good life story. We're getting towards the end here. I'd like to round things out with some nice story could be funny. Could be Scary could be just something in the design process.

Teryl Todd 55:04
Alright, so if you're going to tell the one I think you're going to tell I'll tell mine first because it's nowhere near as fun. Okay. Well then a few years ago, for me, I carry this first aid kit in the saddle bags on my Harley. And I've got a spider co h1 Hawk bill all serrated in there. And I came across this guy that is slid off the road on his motorcycle on a small highway, springtime, there's gravel on the road, and he's got this. He's wrapped up in that stuff that looks like orange chicken wire, put her put around the edge of turns and whatnot. Yeah. And he's trying like heck to get out of it. And I'm looking around at his buddies, and they're all writing this specific type of motorcycle, and they're all just kind of trying to pull on the stuff. So I grabbed First Aid Kit and and cut the guy out and I'm looking around I'm like, Well guys, no one has a knife. And seriously this whole group of riders so like eight guys, none of them had a knife on them. I that may have been part of what got me more into doing useful, purposeful things with the knife industry because it just blew my mind that they didn't have a first aid kit even with a pair of scissors and

Bob DeMarco 56:29
that's well I bet they weren't riding Harley's Yeah, what are they putting their saddle bags in there? I mean, you know,

Teryl Todd 56:36
unicorns fairy dust I don't know.

Unknown Speaker 56:40
Hey, come on now are you steroid me a Gustin Ducati

Unknown Speaker 56:43
It wasn't me a desk a MV or deck as I had the same pack in my on my duck.

Seth Todd 56:50
Speaking of the hawk bill spyderco, there's about a five inch scar across my arm right there and that'll be the story for another day. Oh man. Now cuz from That was from a hawk bill sweated blood spyderco Geez

Bob DeMarco 57:04
You don't mess with those do they're dangerous

Unknown Speaker 57:07
yeah

Bob DeMarco 57:08
I'm takes very little doesn't it?

Unknown Speaker 57:10
Yeah I've got a delicate scar cross my hand too I guess we could talk about that but anyhow oh gosh

Bob DeMarco 57:16
you guys I'm gonna have to have you back on just for your scar stories

Unknown Speaker 57:19
yeah the yeah we'll go with the mall where one so and I'm going to jinx myself all the hell here not having wouldn't knock on but I have in the entire life past four and a half years I think the last night I cut myself on was what was that stupid little spider co that I sent you Terrell that I didn't like

Unknown Speaker 57:40
there's been a couple I don't have the titanium and the one. Oh yeah, that's one of the M for one looks like it. Yeah, look, I bet it's a flipper. I can't think of what that thing's called six

Unknown Speaker 57:49
years ago or something. I kept myself disassembling that thing before I sent it to him but that was probably the last time I cut myself with a knife and an all of this knife making and I see all the horrible video. is an Instagram of these knife makers. I've been lucky enough not to cut myself in a significant way with a knife at least maybe with tools here and there. I'm in that whole time and whenever I got the first malware prototype that thing was so stabbing so sharp and not the kind of knife that I normally carry. I carried it and I was like, hey, this thing's really good. I put it damn near completely through my index finger the second day. And then, and then I then proceeded to cut myself with it probably three more times in the first two weeks. With a pokey stabbing cuts, most of them were pokey stabbing cuts. I just wasn't used to that big long, Gabby blade. So I always tell people when they buy that one I'm like, you need to be careful with this because it will give you a chance

Bob DeMarco 58:51
to say this, but you did it to yourself, man.

Unknown Speaker 58:53
I did.

Unknown Speaker 58:55
I agree.

Unknown Speaker 58:57
Every scenario I did. It's myself. Yeah.

Unknown Speaker 59:01
And I want other one, I would say, so I have a Cortana here, a knife story. So no longer whether she's not here but my ex girlfriend I have to give internal probably would to have to get a lot of props to most women. If you're like, Hey, I'm going to make a knife and spend all my time in the shop the next two years would have been like, this is bullshit. She was super supportive of all of this stuff. And this probably wouldn't happen without her. I

Teryl Todd 59:32
I want to break in there. She wasn't just supportive then she still Leo's Oh, that's cool.

Unknown Speaker 59:40
Yeah. And I think the second year for Christmas, I had this whenever I was a kid and Terrell can tell you I did martial arts from the time I was like eight till I was like 16 and I had switched schools a couple times in the school. I was going to whenever you got your black belt, first degree decided black You got a sword, like a katana sword? Of course, it was a cheap like mall sword, right? I went and tested got my first degree black belt. And they were like, yeah, we're going to order the sword get your belt and everything like that on the next week the school went out of business. And I never, never got that sword. And I told her this story around Christmas and she was like, Well, why don't you get one now? And I'm like, Well, I'm I'm older now. And I'm like, I'm not just going to get a mall sword. It's got to be like the real deal. She worked in oil and gas and she had one of her VP was in Japan, doing a bunch of work in oil and gas. And she had him go out and find a place and find a guy and she had them hand forge Damascus Katana blade and have it sent back over here.

Unknown Speaker 1:00:54
Oh my god. Just Yeah.

Unknown Speaker 1:00:56
And it's awesome. It is absolutely awesome. And he did bring One thing talking about her, the one thing that Seth and I have both had with her, and my wife is more than 100% support. And that is so important. Whenever, you know, Seth works a more than full time job, I work a more than full time job. And then we're in the shop staring at CAD, whenever we're home or making videos or whatever we're doing. And these women have, I'm not going to say they don't ever fuss, but they fully understand where we're trying to go, and they're fully supportive of it.

Bob DeMarco 1:01:41
And that's the I don't know, you just cannot ask for more.

Unknown Speaker 1:01:45
Yeah, it's, it's pretty awesome.

Bob DeMarco 1:01:48
I've heard a couple of other people kind of saying the same thing, you know, like, couldn't have done this without my wife's support. And, you know, I think that's great. I think That's that's what the whole point is.

Unknown Speaker 1:02:03
Right now my wife does have a What the heck is it? Oh, she got out of the whole thing she has a interval bolster in 390 chef's knife with ivory or not ivory that the dark wood the ebony Ebony with Ebony handles that she got out of this so she's got a little bit out of it.

Bob DeMarco 1:02:28
Yeah you keep that thing sharp can make some good meals with that. So how do people find Todd knife and tool knives How do they buy them where should tell everyone where they should look you up and where they should go to buy one of your suite knives.

Unknown Speaker 1:02:43
Instagram at Todd knife and tool on zero is that what is over 42 Terrell for YouTube for anything phone Terrell on the reviews and all of that stuff. Right now knives are out with we and best tech the knives that are out there are Roxy the Roxy for in the mall where the Roxy and Roxy for our with we and those are available at blade HQ, White Mountain knives, you know knife center all the major online retailers and then pretty much across the world I don't know where people are listening to you but Asia, Russia, most of Europe, those those knives are available in the coming kind of a year and a half, two years. There will be the showed in which will be out hopefully before Christmas with best tech. The root kit will be prototype probably but blade show West. I don't think me or Terrell are going to be there but you might be able to see it if you're there. And then the Roxy three will come from we also and that should be out at some point next year. And then the exploit will be out with best tech probably at some point next year. And then the info sec will be out with best tech at some point next year.

Bob DeMarco 1:03:55
Wow. You've got a lot coming out. That's amazing. You're like the second Coming have we

Teryl Todd 1:04:02
No we're not trying to do that many I had looking at the list you got them all.

Bob DeMarco 1:04:07
That's pretty tremendous guys Terrell and Seth Todd from Todd knife and tool. Thank you so much for coming on the Knife Junkie podcast. It's been a real pleasure meeting you and I always love talking to brothers. Because I can relate. You guys are making some really beautiful designs and you got me hooked on the Roxy for so I'm gonna have to seek that one out.

Teryl Todd 1:04:25
It's a good one. I I don't I just got one actually. But I don't carry them as much because of what I do. I carry the malware most of the time. But yeah, we appreciate it.

Bob DeMarco 1:04:39
We'll have to get back into that another time because I'm interested. But that's for another time. Because I'm like why would you carry the malware over the Roxy I like the Roxy better. Anyway guys, thank you so much for coming on. It's been a pleasure. Take care. Okay to

Announcer 1:04:53
follow The Knife Junkie on Instagram at The Knife Junkie. com slash Instagram

Jim Person 1:04:58
we're back on the Knife Junkie podcast. Episode Number 54 of our show our Sunday interview show and not only one but two for the price of one if you will today the the Todd brothers Terrell and Seth great interview there with Todd knife and tool guys, Bob. Yeah, Jim I love speaking with brothers. We talked to the Williamson brothers from Fareham Forge. I just love seeing the dynamic and the you know, I love seeing two brothers together right because I do have one

I was gonna say very well get your brother on here with all man I'd love to I'd love to. But I don't know if the rest of the world is ready. Well,

Bob DeMarco 1:05:34
yeah. key takeaways, what was what was the one thing that really resonated with you in your conversation with Carolyn? So? Well, first of all, they they have a slew of new knives coming out. So they're their font of creativity. I think together they bounce stuff off one another and they just keep coming out with new knives. And, you know, as you heard towards the end of the interview they have I wasn't really counting but a number of knives go went out from best tech and we in the near future. But the real thing that resonated with me is this whole idea of an encore career. You know, sometimes you gotta do what you gotta do and you have a job and eventually the luster wears off of that job but you know, when you have something brewing in the back of your mind you'd like to do later when you're maybe emancipated from that job because the kids are away out of the house or whatever it is. You know that that's an idea that that I keep close and to see two guys succeeding at that before they're even retired. And and making it all about what they love, which is knives. It's inspiring to me.

Unknown Speaker 1:06:39
Well As always, if you go to the Knife Junkie, com slash the episode number of the podcast, you'll find more links, things like that, that we tried to incorporate into the show notes as well as a transcription of the show if you want to kind of look and read and that kind of thing. So that would be The Knife Junkie. com slash 54. The Knife junkie.com slash five For for this episode coming up mid week we're going to do our Halloween Eve show I guess the day before Halloween we released the supplemental which is what we're calling it right now until we come up with a better name The Knife Junkie supplemental episode so we hope you'll join us again Wednesday night Thursday morning for that. So for Bob The Knife Junkie DeMarco I'm Jim The Knife Newbie Person and I want to thank you for listening to episode number 54 of the Knife Junkie podcast

Announcer 1:07:27
Thanks for listening to the Knife Junkie podcast If you enjoyed the show, please rate and review it review the podcast com for show notes for today's episode additional resources and to listen to past episodes visit our website The Knife Junkie. com You can also watch our latest videos on YouTube at The Knife Junkie. com slash YouTube check out some great night photos on the Knife Junkie. com slash Instagram and join our Facebook group at The Knife Junkie. com slash Facebook and if you have a question or comment email them to Bob at The Knife Junkie calm or call our toll four seven listener line at 724-466-4487 and you may hear your comment or question answered on an upcoming episode of the Knife Junkie podcast.